Forum Thread

Ability to get ahead by region

Reply to ThreadDisplaying 1 - 15 of 33 1 2 3 Next
  • Center Left
    Independent
    Central, FL
    Are you sure you want to delete this post?
        
    I heard an interesting financial story today on National Public Radio. It was about how America has always been the
    land of opportunity and how here anyone could get ahead..... Well, I regret that I've not yet found a link to the story.
    Perhaps I will. There are some areas in this country where you have a good chance to rise up from your social class to
    one of the more affluent. Areas include the US NE part of the country, The plains states, Minnesota, Salt Lake city, Seattle, San
    Francisco, and Houston. (Just Houston for TX).
    There was also a map (so they described) that did show the areas where you were least likely to advance. It started with
    Michigan, went south through Ohio and Indiana and continued south through Florida. Including ATL Georgia, the Carolinas,
    etc. It was sad for me because I live in the negative zone. They checked the research to include many different factors to
    cover everything. In the more promising areas, the chance of advancing upwardly was 10 - 15 % whereas in the negative
    zone the chance of advancing was around 4%. The Midwest and the SE were seen as the negative area.
    In this study, the rich remained rich because they could afford quality educations for their children. It was a look at anyone's ability
    to be at a financial place at 30, and to end up in a much more comfortable seat at 55, 60.
    ** ** ** ** ** ** ** Link to story on post at the bottom of this page ** ** ** ** ** ** ** **
  • Other Party
    Nebraska
    Are you sure you want to delete this post?
        
    Which side of the line or the zone did the city of Detroit fall?

    I have not seen nor heard of this story, so if you get a link, please post it.

    If Detroit is on the "good side" then I'll know what to think of this "financial story" and then I'll know how much stock to put into their conclusions.
  • Strongly Liberal
    Independent
    Seattle, WA
    Are you sure you want to delete this post?
        
    I hope you find the link to the story, because this is fascinating to me.

    Income disparity and inequity does not come only from religion, of course, but it certainly has something to do with it. An interest take on that is in an article on poverty in America, and it discusses the "Reaganite Gospel of Prosperity," which of course Reagan got from Southern televangelists.

    The article starts out as follows:

    "The idea that 'God helps those who help themselves' is deeply ingrained in the American culture, and that's because there is a strong element of truth in it.

    "However, wealthy right-wing partisans in America, most of whom claim to be Christians, have always tended to distort that idea claiming it means that you are simply on your own, that the poor deserve their lot, and that government's role is not to promote the general welfare to ensure domestic tranquility (even though the Founding Fathers said it is).

    "That is why especially during the last 30 years we have increasingly seen politicians ignoring the plight of the working poor, the poor, the disabled and the elderly, preferring to declare people should be self-reliant while at the same time providing the wealthiest few with great entitlement and privilege, pretending that is the patriotic and Christian thing to do.

    "That's why it is so important to understand that it's not. The 'Religious Right' in America merely managed to turn Christianity upside down by taking isolated sentences from the Bible to "prove" their right-wing political ideology was Christian.

    "For example, Luke 19:26 states that Jesus of Nazareth said: 'I tell you that to everyone who has, more will be given, but from those that have not, even what they have will be taken away.'

    "The Reaganite 'Religious Right focuses on that because they think that justifies their claim that their wealth is a reward from God, and that the poor deserve their lot because they are just lazy and 'not self-reliant,' as Ronald Reagan said. However, they simply ignore everything else Jesus said about the rich and poor, and they misinterpret and misunderstand (or ignore) the context and meaning of Luke 19:26."

    "In the greater context of Luke 19:8-26 Jesus was talking partly about the fact that we generally reap what we sow, and he was specifically talking about the rewards of earning an honest and fair profit from an honest investment. However, Jesus qualified such statements. Jesus also said that it is wrong to reap what you did not sow, or profit unjustly because you were tempted by greed and lust for money. Moreover, he said that you should do unto others as you would have others do unto you, and treat all others as you would want to be treated if you were them -- and be fair, just, kind, charitable, and generous."

    -----

    But it's not just Reaganism. The "religious right" didn't just rise up with Reagan. It's been around for a long time. They even fought against Thomas Jefferson in 1800. But they have always believed that as so-called "God fearing" or "born again Christians," they are entitled to great wealth, and also entitled to power and superiority.

    That has translated to their fight against the minimum wage, against labor unions, etc. And it even justifies farmers and ranchers to pay their farm and field hands far less than even the minimum wage -- as if they were in the lower class of peasants who deserve their lot.

    In other words, their idea of religion gives them a tremendous sense of entitlement and superiority, and it has given them an amazing amount of political power.

    They of course claim that if you just have faith and work hard God will reward you and make you prosperous. However, the fact is that no amount of faith and no amount of hard work now rewards most people with even a fair living wage, due to Reaganism. In fact, about 40 percent of the population is barely getting by and 20 percent are in poverty. And the middle class keeps shrinking and more and more are falling into the working poor population that cannot afford all necessities of life.

    There's something very wrong with this picture -- very, very wrong. And it's shameful.
    .
    .
  • Other Party
    Nebraska
    Are you sure you want to delete this post?
        
    In my opinion it is not all or even mostly the fault of religion or Reagan or Reaganism. It is a mindset of Americans which has shifted over the past few decades from self sufficiency to an entitlement mindset. We have gone from the "greatest generation" to the "most entitled generation". I have heard that 49% of households get government support and much of it is not a handout but far too much of it is.

    Lots of people need help, we all know that, but there are far too many who CHOOSE not to work and just live on government handouts.

    Why should they work when they can qualify for a government handout for the rest of their lives?

    And there a million reasons for it, but mostly greed and laziness.

    Food stamps, "crazy" checks, fake disability, medicare fraud there is so much waste and fraud that it is almost unbelievable.
  • Strongly Liberal
    Independent
    Seattle, WA
    Are you sure you want to delete this post?
        
    jamesn Wrote: In my opinion it is not all or even mostly the fault of religion or Reagan or Reaganism. It is a mindset of Americans which has shifted over the past few decades from self sufficiency to an entitlement mindset. We have gone from the "greatest generation" to the "most entitled generation". I have heard that 49% of households get government support and much of it is not a handout but far too much of it is.

    Lots of people need help, we all know that, but there are far too many who CHOOSE not to work and just live on government handouts.

    Why should they work when they can qualify for a government handout for the rest of their lives? And there a million reasons for it, but mostly greed and laziness. Food stamps, "crazy" checks, fake disability, medicare fraud there is so much waste and fraud that it is almost unbelievable.
    .

    JamesN,

    There are some people in America who choose not to work, and there are some people who fraudulently take advantage of programs designed to help those who need help. However, their number is small and they are a small minority.

    Right-wing conservative Republicans, Tea Partiers and Libertarians just like to claim that their number is great and that they are the "entitlement class." In fact, right-wing deceivers claim that America is a "welfare state," but they simply ignore the fact that the Founders intended government to "promote the general welfare."

    The real entitlement class is the wealthiest 11 percent of Americans who think their wealth entitles them to rule. They think they are entitled to pay little or no taxes, and they've bribed politicians so much for so long that they've been enabled to pay little or nothing because of all the tax loopholes, tax shelters, tax deductions, subsidies, etc.

    The lie that ignores that government should promote the general welfare is the same lie that Ronald Reagan spread while he was labeling poor people as "welfare queens" and insisting that people must be "self-reliant" and "not dependent on government" -- creating the illusion that people being assisted by government programs were just lazy and good for nothing, and that government shouldn't "coddle" anyone.

    The truth, however, is that Reaganism and Reaganomics are the reasons why, as the latest UNICEF report on child poverty showed, 23.1 percent of American children live in poverty, giving the United States the second highest rate of child poverty out of 35 developed countries. Only Romania ranked higher in child poverty. And, in 2010, 20.5 million Americans were living on less than half of the federal poverty level.

    Many poor people who suffer in poverty are unable to work because they are elderly or disabled or unemployed through no fault of their own, and most poor people are in the working poor population who work full time for a living but are not paid a fair living wage.

    More importantly, about 79 percent of that 23.1 percent of children in poverty live in households where at least one adult is working full time!

    Do you realize you are trying to perpetuate misleading Reaganite propaganda?
    .
  • Other Party
    Nebraska
    Are you sure you want to delete this post?
        
    Guy I'm not perpetuating the ..."Reaganite propaganda"... I'm just telling you what I believe, that's what this DemocraticHub is for. You probably disagree with me. I have formed my opinion from what I have seen with my own eyes, not from what I have read in one report. I'm not saying that this report is incorrect, I am saying I read reports such as these and use other sources as well and form my own opinion.

    You think that it is a small minority who chooses not to work and chooses to fraudulently take advantage of entitlement programs, but the number is a lot larger than you think. We shall disagree on that point, because it is a much larger percentage.

    I certainly do not use talking points or statistics from Republicans, Tea Partiers, or Libertarians, nor the other side. I believe that far too many people do allow others to form their opinions for them. Both sides have many brainwashed followers and I think it is best to form ones own opinion.
  • Strongly Liberal
    Independent
    Seattle, WA
    Are you sure you want to delete this post?
        
    jamesn Wrote: Guy I'm not perpetuating the ..."Reaganite propaganda"... I'm just telling you what I believe, that's what this DemocraticHub is for. You probably disagree with me. I have formed my opinion from what I have seen with my own eyes, not from what I have read in one report. I'm not saying that this report is incorrect, I am saying I read reports such as these and use other sources as well and form my own opinion.

    You think that it is a small minority who chooses not to work and chooses to fraudulently take advantage of entitlement programs, but the number is a lot larger than you think. We shall disagree on that point, because it is a much larger percentage.

    I certainly do not use talking points or statistics from Republicans, Tea Partiers, or Libertarians, nor the other side. I believe that far too many people do allow others to form their opinions for them. Both sides have many brainwashed followers and I think it is best to form ones own opinion.
    James,

    Sorry if I'm not right about your motivation. But usually those who blame the victims and claim that they "know of many cases of fraud" perpetrated by "lazy bums" really don't know of many, because there aren't many.

    Of course, the level of welfare or public benefit fraud is disputed. All we know for sure is that there are many myths about the levels of benefit fraud, in large part due to the claims of Ronald Reagan and Reaganites ever since.

    But we do know a lot of facts about it, and the facts that can be found do not support the claim of widespread benefit fraud.

    For example, take unemployment Insurance. Congressional testimony has stated that the level of unemployment insurance fraud was 1.9 percent of all unemployment insurance benefits.

    Take food stamps. The fraud rate for SNAP (Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program), what we used to call food stamps, is minimal as well. According to the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities the levels of SNAP overpayments (including fraud) is declining, from about 8 percent in 1990 to about 3 percent recently.

    Take Medicare. According to recent statistics there are more than 58 million people that receive coverage through Medicaid. Recent statistics show there were a total of 10,685 fraud investigations and only 824 convictions from 1,011 indictments.

    The trouble is, right-wing propagandists have been misleading Americans for 30 years, and they've been so successful that about 50 percent of the American people think that those in poverty deserve it.

    For example, it brings to mind stories John Stossell used to tell on the 20/20 TV show. He would, for instance, go to a soup kitchen line and look for someone who would make it seem like all those getting a free meal didn't really need it, and he would turn the camera on them and interview them. In other words, he was a crooked, biased journalist who was really saying, "See? These are just feeloaders." And he did many similar stories, spouting right-wing propaganda disguised as "journalism."

    In my view, many Americans have had the wool pulled over their eyes by some very clever, cunning, wealthy propagandists.

    But then, we're getting sidetracked. The title of the thread is about using religion to gain and hold political power and the ability to get ahead, and there's a lot more evidence to reveal the fact that the "Christian Right" has been doing that with gusto, violating the intent of the Founders regarding religion, violating Article 6 and the 1st Amendment to the Constitution, violating IRS tax exemption codes, and also violating the core, universal teachings of Jesus.
    .
    .
  • Other Party
    Nebraska
    Are you sure you want to delete this post?
        
    You are correct, we have gotten sidetracked. I still do not think that any religion, or any one person is to blame for the country's woes. I don't think you can show me that there's anything more to blame than greed, laziness and the "entitlement mentality" in America today.

    Why work when the government will pay people to not work? And THAT is todays mentality.

    And as for your ..."facts"... about unemployment, food stamps/SNAP, and Medicare...well if you want to believe the ..."Congressional testimony"... and other government reports as the absolute truth, that's OK but I choose to be skeptical of government thieves and crooks reporting on other government thieves and crooks running government programs, especially when it comes to things such as reporting on fraud, waste, and abuse. Sorry, but I have been too close to all that to accept all those numbers without a grain of salt.

    In my view, many Americans have had the wool pulled over their eyes by some very clever, cunning, wealthy government officials.
  • Strongly Liberal
    Independent
    Seattle, WA
    Are you sure you want to delete this post?
        
    jamesn Wrote: You are correct, we have gotten sidetracked. I still do not think that any religion, or any one person is to blame for the country's woes. I don't think you can show me that there's anything more to blame than greed, laziness and the "entitlement mentality" in America today.

    Why work when the government will pay people to not work? And THAT is todays mentality.

    And as for your ..."facts"... about unemployment, food stamps/SNAP, and Medicare...well if you want to believe the ..."Congressional testimony"... and other government reports as the absolute truth, that's OK but I choose to be skeptical of government thieves and crooks reporting on other government thieves and crooks running government programs, especially when it comes to things such as reporting on fraud, waste, and abuse. Sorry, but I have been too close to all that to accept all those numbers without a grain of salt.

    In my view, many Americans have had the wool pulled over their eyes by some very clever, cunning, wealthy government officials.
    .

    James,

    Religion is in fact the reason why in the "Bible Belt" states, as well as other states during the last thirty years, religion plays a big part in the ability of "true believers" to get ahead while so many people who don't fit the mold find it very difficult to get ahead, and those in poverty are unable to escape poverty.

    The reason is deeply engrained in American society, and its based on the idea that "God helps those who help themselves," which admittedly has a lot of truth in it. However, the "Religious Right" has twisted it and taken isolated sentences from the Christian canon in order to claim that the rich are blessed and the poor deserve their lot -- which actually turns Christianity up-side-down.

    But regarding poverty and "welfare fraud," I'm not surprised that you simply ignore and dismiss facts, because you can provide nothing to support your claim except to say you "have seen welfare fraud" and "know there's a lot of it."

    Let me tell you a little more about the guy who started the trend toward "welfare fraud" myths.

    The most famous myth about "welfare fraud" was begun by Ronald Reagan during a campaign. Reagan told a story of a woman from Chicago who was arrested for welfare fraud. Reagan said: "She has 80 names, 30 addresses, 12 Social Security cards and is collecting veteran's benefits on four non-existing deceased husbands. And she is collecting Social Security on her cards. She's got Medicaid, getting food stamps, and she is collecting welfare under each of her names."

    But the real truth came out when many investigative reporters tried to track down this "Welfare Queen" and found she did not exist. Then David Zucchino, a Pulitzer Prize-winning reporter, spent a year with welfare mothers and wrote a best-selling book, The Myth of the Welfare Queen, which compared Reagan's myth and fabricated image to the reality of mothers on public assistance, the vast majority of whom would much rather be self-sufficient but need help.

    The main fact, of course, is what I've already told you but you just ignored -- that 97 percent of the 15 Million American children who live in poverty live in households in which at least one adult is working full time.

    That's a fact that reveals that the real problem is unfair, insufficient wages, and it shows very clearly that the lowest incomes in America are not living wages and do not enable households to afford the basic necessities of life.

    In spite of facts, Ronald Reagan established the myth that supporting welfare is a burden causing financial hardship to working class Americans.

    The fact, however, is that Reagan established that myth to slash AFDC (Aid to Families with Dependent Children) and Food Stamps, which were only 2 percent of the budget. (Library of Congress, Congressional Research Service, "Cash and Noncash Benefits for Persons with Limited Income: Eligibility Rules, Recipient and Expenditure Data, Report 93-832 EPW and earlier reports.)

    Another Reagan myth is that poverty and homelessness have grown in spite of the trillions of dollars spent since 1965 to help the poor; therefore, these programs have failed.

    The fact, however, is that these programs have and are succeeding in getting people out of poverty and homelessness. Roosevelt’s New Deal programs helped and still help millions of people become part of the work force, and help them when they can’t work. In 1964, Johnson declared War on Poverty with his Great Society program. The increased welfare payments reduced poverty to 12 percent by the end of the 60s.

    As Nancy Amidei said in a speech at the Family Reunion conference in Tennessee, 1992: "Whoopi Goldberg is a former welfare mom. Carol Burnett is a former welfare kid. Joan Growe, the Secretary of State of Minnesota is a former welfare mom. Judge Sedgewick, an appeals court judge, is a former welfare mom. Two members of the Montana legislature, two members of the Wisconsin legislature, a couple members of the Pennsylvania legislature. Bishop Weakland in Milwaukee is a former welfare kid. Six members of Congress are former welfare kids. I have run into former welfare kids and former welfare moms who are now PhDs and County Executives, nurses, career Army officials, police, Head Start aides. They are all over the place; they are terrific people and they are welfare success stories."

    But then, you aren't bothered by facts, or reality.

    Instead, you would rather make a rather amazing statement, considering this forum's political focus. You say: "Why work when the government will pay people not to work? And THAT is todays reality!"

    Really?

    The main way the government pays people not to work is in subsidies, such as the farm subsidies that pay farmers not to grow crops.

    The facts are that the vast majority who have to resort to public assistance get off the roles as soon as they can, and most Americans who live in poverty actually work full time but are not paid a living wage.

    Mind you, I am fully aware of how corrupt most politicians are, but I am also aware that most of the corruption is caused by the bribery of "lobbyists" and the wealthiest few who have bought the best government they can.

    But, as for the facts about poverty and welfare fraud myths, I know I've just wasted my time as far as you are concerned. I post this for the benefit of others.
    .
  • Other Party
    Nebraska
    Are you sure you want to delete this post?
        
    Guy I think we are sidetracked again. That's OK.

    I'm glad you posted a reply even though you seem to think it won't do me any good. We disagree on some things but I'm still interested in what you have to say.

    And we agree on some things! farm subsidies should be cut and the entire program eventually eliminated or nearly so. Let the free market decide what should be grown and what should not. Usually the more that government intrudes into ANY industry the worse off it is and this is a good example. If a few farmers go bankrupt, then so be it.

    You can blame religion or Reagan for all of Americas woes if you want, I know other people do too. You are entitled to your opinion.

    Good examples of the welfare moms and kids, I'm happy for them. I know that most welfare recepients do have a valid need but I also know that many people get benefits that they should not. There's a LOT of fraud out there and just because the government says there's not, doesn't make it so.

    Here's just one example of how our senior government officials lie: Mr James Clapper, National Director of Intelligence, a few weeks ago was testifying on Capital Hill and was asked "Does the NSA collect any type of data at all on millions, or hundreds of millions of Americans?"

    Mr Clapper answered "No sir" Not wittingly"

    We soon found out how big a lie that was. I know he's not with the welfare program, but this is just a recent example of a SENIOR government official who lies. And this testimony was under oath and he was testifying to a US Senator. No problem. If you choose to believe everything that your government tells us, then that's your choice. I choose to be skeptical when they tell us something and it doesn't sound right.

    The great thing about America is you can believe what you want and I can disagree.
  • Strongly Liberal
    Independent
    Seattle, WA
    Are you sure you want to delete this post?
        
    James,

    I like that attitude much better.

    There are probably many areas where we agree. In addition to the things you mentioned, I agree that there is much fraud, such as Medicare fraud where payments are collected by those who don't need or deserve them. But as for "welfare fraud," the government has no reason to lie about or skew statistics that I cited.

    Also, I confess you got my back up with your first post about "welfare fraud," because I worked for nearly two decades in a state human services agency and I know the federal and state statistics. I am very aware the the reality, and the huge and growing need of all the people who used to be in the middle class but have fallen into the working poor population who suffer many if not all of the symptoms of poverty.

    As for government agency malfeasance and violation of the Constitution, that's getting way off the track, but I agree it's important. In fact, I agree with the following statement in an article on violence, crime and corruption:

    "Granted, most law enforcement officials do a good job, but the number of overzealous officers is growing. They have developed a sense of entitlement that is not only at odds with the spirit of the U.S. Constitution, it is in violation of the Fourth Amendment, which clearly states that the people have a right 'to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures ... but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.';

    "That Fourth Amendment standard has not changed. And while Police officers and federal agents must now have "reasonable suspicion and/or probable cause” to approach individuals suspected of violating a law, they cannot merely have reasonable suspicion. They must also have probable cause, and it must be 'supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons of things to be seized.'

    "In spite of that, today’s law enforcement officials apparently have a new standard whereby all they need is suspicion, or a hunch, or hearsay."

    Of course, that's referring to police and federal agencies like the DEA more than the NSA, but it's really the same problem caused by overzealous government officials and agents.
  • Other Party
    Nebraska
    Are you sure you want to delete this post?
        
    Guy I take issue with one thing:

    You say..."the government has no reason to lie about or skew statistics that I cited."... I think that my point is that some government reports are compiled by employees who want to produce the desired results. Their motto: Let's don't rock the boat, let's show that the program is running at peak efficiency, don't cause controversy by producing negative reports, give the results that the higher-ups want to hear. Let's assure the boss people that they are doing a great job so that they will be promoted and will promote us, in turn.

    Let's take care of them so that they will take care of us. Just keep our eyes on the big brass ring and get as much of that federal retirement pay as possible as soon as possible.

    And there is a LOT of that that goes on.

    Every big government program has fraud, waste, and abuse, and especially every program which sends money (or equilivent) to citizens such as food stamps, welfare, social security, housing programs...etc EVERY one of them is a target. Just google it and their will be some sites which will reassure you that your numbers are correct, and there will be some sites which will agree more with my opinion. It's your choice, I know that many do not want to hear a dissenting opinion.

    I like your attitude a little better, as well. Maybe we can be civil, after all.
  • Strongly Liberal
    Independent
    Seattle, WA
    Are you sure you want to delete this post?
        
    James,

    Having worked in a state government agency program that had close ties to a national program, I know that some of what you say is true. For example, I know that federal government statistics on poverty are based on very old and outdated formulas that were appropriate in 1955 but are not at all appropriate now. That's why most state governments operate on the reality that the real poverty levels are actually far higher than the Feds say it is.

    However, I doubt there are many government employees, whether federal or state, who purposely skew or fudge research findings or data or statistics to "produce the desired results." How could they be sure what their bosses desired? Some bosses may like to see that the problems are worse, which would make the mission of the agency more necessary, while other bosses may like to see that there is less of a problem, which would show that the agency is doing a good job. And I doubt there are many bosses who would be so stupid as to order employees to produce false or skewed reports. Most would be too afraid that it would come back to bite them in the butt.

    In my experience, working with many state human services agencies, as well as their local affiliates, the vast majority of employees were conscientious, dedicated, honest, and highly motivated by a spirit of service to children and families in need. Your experience may be different, but if you have witnessed dishonest government employees, I would not therefore assume that all of them are.
  • Center Left
    Independent
    Central, FL
    Are you sure you want to delete this post?
        
    Finally I found a link. The story I heard was on National Public Radio. Therefore, I've been checking NPR's web site. It was found on Huffington Post.
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/22/income-mobility-location_n_3635008.htm...

    At the bottom of the page (link) there are 10 related stories/links.
  • Other Party
    Nebraska
    Are you sure you want to delete this post?
        
    Guy You are right most federal employees are good dedicated people. A few bad apples but those will be found anywhere.

    But even those good employees are not above tailoring a report, a count, an inspection to the desired result. I remember once a boss asked for more customer survey results before the approaching end-of-month count. A young man said "How many do you want and what ratings do you want to see?" The boss replied "Give me 5 surveys today and make 4 of them 10's" 10 being the highest rating. The young man got out the survey forms and started concocting the desired results. It was done so casually that I'm sure it was a regular occurance.

    Now most of the time I would imagine that it is not done that way, and the surveys that I refer to were not of high level importance. On the really big, high level, important matters the boss would call meetings and tell everyone how important a project was and then hint of the result that he was looking for. He would never send an official memo, or put anything like that on paper or on email. He had other ways to let people know what he expected to see. He could never come out TELL his people to fudge the numbers. Lots of hints and showing what happened last year and how we should be compared to last years numbers. ..."How could they be sure what their bosses desired?"... This is how.

    Another time a big, annual material inventory was done, and when it was finished my supervisor said "I can't take these numbers in to the boss." He then started creating fictitious work orders to charge materials to. All done to cover missing materials and make the boss happy and make the "books" close enough. I assume he did it every year.

    The point is: as much as possible tell higher ups and HQ people what they want to hear. It keeps them happy and out of our way so we can be free to do our jobs without interference.

    Most government employees are good people, they are just doing what they have to do to make themselves and their bosses look good. Promotions, raises and bonuses are the main reason. Also to justify their manpower...they almost always want more manpower. The more people you supervise, the more money you can be paid.

    James N