Forum Thread

Illegal Imogration vs. legal Imogration

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    We are spending money on education, health and feeding people who are not paying taxes. We are just burning, throwing away or giving money to anyone who wants it and doesn't work for it.

    If there was an employment center on the border. Then anyone who wants to come to our country would need to be hired by an American who wants to put them to work, pay taxes, be registered and be legal. Then when the season or other cercumstances that would prevent them from working and have in the recent past have payed taxes would be elegable for relief. Anyone who is not registered to work would be ILLEGAL or a tourist and not eligible to work, pay taxes or recieve any benifites.

    Or make Mexico part of the United States of America and then there would be no illegals to worry about.
     
    And have one language. Sorry if this is too simple.
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    lbh123:

    What's often forgotten in the debate over illegal immigration is that large parts of the Southwestern United States were once actually part of MEXICO, and not the other way around  .. Spanish has been the primary language spoken in that area since the mid 1500's

    You can see "the larger Mexico" in the article shown below:

    tohell-andback.blogspot.com/2011/05/tequila.html

    Since our political discussions too often lack genunine humor, be sure to listen to the video

    One of the diversionary tactics used by the Republican candidates is illegal immigration, which is FAR from the most pressing problem this country faces today. As a matter of fact, immigrants from Mexico have DECREASED dramtically over the last twenty years.
    Since the REAL Americans spoke close to 300 languages before the first permanent European settlers landed here, it's not realistic to expect that only one language be spoken. The  IMPORTANT issues of today (which the Republican candidates aren't even talking about) can be found at the link below:

    tohell-andback.blogspot.com/2011/11/immigration-man.html

    If you view some of the closing paragraphs at the link below, you'll discover that within 30 years, the MINORITIES in this country will actually be the MAJORITY ..


    tohell-andback.blogspot.com/2009/06/press-3-for-chinese.html


    Thanks for listening. Be sure to press "2" for Spanish.

    As they say in L.A., "pulse "2" para el espanol!"
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    that guy in Arizona Wrote: lbh123:

    What's often forgotten in the debate over illegal immigration is that large parts of the Southwestern United States were once actually part of MEXICO, and not the other way around  .. Spanish has been the primary language spoken in that area since the mid 1500's

    You can see "the larger Mexico" in the article shown below:

    tohell-andback.blogspot.com/2011/05/tequila.html

    Since our political discussions too often lack genunine humor, be sure to listen to the video

    One of the diversionary tactics used by the Republican candidates is illegal immigration, which is FAR from the most pressing problem this country faces today. As a matter of fact, immigrants from Mexico have DECREASED dramtically over the last twenty years.
    Since the REAL Americans spoke close to 300 languages before the first permanent European settlers landed here, it's not realistic to expect that only one language be spoken. The  IMPORTANT issues of today (which the Republican candidates aren't even talking about) can be found at the link below:

    tohell-andback.blogspot.com/2011/11/immigration-man.html

    If you view some of the closing paragraphs at the link below, you'll discover that within 30 years, the MINORITIES in this country will actually be the MAJORITY ..


    tohell-andback.blogspot.com/2009/06/press-3-for-chinese.html


    Thanks for listening. Be sure to press "2" for Spanish.

    As they say in L.A., "pulse "2" para el espanol!"
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    I just finnish watching the Republican debate: Ginrich only one with a clear view of illegal immigrants in this country.

    11 million immigrants can not be uprooted, it is not conceivable.  we arrived at this point by not punishing the real culprits: Government and employers.  Had government apply stiff sanctions to employers this would not have happened.

    Secured border and apply stiff penalties to employers and illegal immigration will be zero.  Some claim terrorist are coming across Mexican border and that is why they want to build walls, What about the Canadian border?
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    It would help your argument a bit if you knew how to spell immigration. It would help your soul a bit if you acknowledged that your ancestors were "illegals" (as if a human being could be classified "illegal") or refugees.

    I'll cut this short, as I really hate debating with RW sock-puppets.
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    Does no one see it?? Newt's latest mistress has to be of Hispanic heritage...it's so obvious.  Does his current wife know it yet?
    twice a dog...always a dog.
    Reagan in the 80's granted Amnesty to many..now Newt's answer is these people have been here for over 20 years
    and we are just going to tell them to leave?? ...a never ending cycle.....they should have not been here after Reagan's amnesty..but they knew sooner or later...they would get the amnesty again.
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    you forget about Reagan back in the 80' amnesty....when does it end??? It's a never ending cycle.
    btw...Newt's latest mistress must be of Hispanic hertiage
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    #1 Before making a judgment about my opinion, read it all and keep in mind … although my opinion may cause you to be angry and form an opinion about me, that is your right which I honor, because I believe we are all entitled to our own opinion (and so far there is no law against that).
    #2 EVEN MORE IMPORTANT than my personal opinion is the fact that when "push comes to shove", I set my personal opinion aside and make a serious effort to apply common sense, fairness, law, and the greater good for human welfare, to the decisions I make.

    Immigration to my country is a privilege, not a right … regardless of the southwestern USA having been part of Mexico, if you enter this country without permission, you are for all intents and purposes an illegal alien (illegal being the key word), so don‘t try to soften it with a title of "undocumented". You have ignored our law … that makes you a criminal and you have lost any legal advantage or opportunity to enjoy my country’s riches and benefits (which you have not earned or paid for). If your children are born here, they too are illegal aliens. If you come to this country legally, in search of a better life, you are obligated to protect it from intruders and those who would cause harm. You are obligated to help maintain and protect the standard of living this country has built, not accept a poverty wage and live in substandard conditions to get a job, or to put someone else out of theirs. Proudly and unconditionally fly the flag of this country and observe its laws or go back where you came from and change the conditions there to suit your wants and needs.

    National Origin is condition of birth ... my family and ancestors have been in this country, legally, for eleven generations, that pretty much makes me a native. I take pride in my ancestral heritage and the efforts of my ancestors, and since I am a native, my patriotic allegiance is to this country and its traditions. If you come to live in my country, accept my way of life, speak my language, declare your allegiance to this country, do not expect me to change for you. If you find that unacceptable … go back to your country of origin.

    This issue isn't just about Mexican or South American citizens, there are plenty of illegal aliens from Africa, Asia, Australia, Canada, Central America, Europe, and all those little nondescript countries. My neighbor was put out of a construction job by a non-english speaking illegal alien that will work for less than minimum wage ... now neither of them is paying taxes. Guess who's paying for their health care and food stamps and housing.

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    Frank:


    Regardless of whether you feel illegal immigration is a problem or not, the article that appeared in this morning's Arizona Daily Sun will be of interest.

    azdailysun.com/news/national/arizona-lawmakers-say-they-will-build-border-fence/article_4e003b10-0860-5484-ba99-61ca8036ea08.html

    Arizona lawmakers have vowed to build a fence along every inch of the border with Mexico, despite the fact that smugglers frequently have circumvented the existing border using tunnels, catapults, and other methods. So far, they've raised enough money to build roughly 50 yards of fencing.

    The Federal government has spent $2.5 billion for 650 miles of the existing border, and have estimated that it will cost an additional $6.5 billion to maintain it over the next 20 years. I'm not as concerned about illegal immigration as some people are, since I feel that our country has far more important issues to worry about (starting with members of Congress learning how to cooperate for the common good).
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    I wholeheartedly agree with Paynattention.  His opinion is of great importance to this country.  I'm a native American of the Penobscot Indians of Maine.  My ancestors were here long before the white man arrived.  In regards to the illegal immigrants there are a few items that may be of interest and should be a concern for all.  
    First, Most illegal immigrants don't pay taxes which would cover in part their medical bills, food stamps, utility bills or cover their housing expenses.  Not to mention the overall costs for law enforcement, fire and ambulance services, emergency room visits.
    Second, Most drive cars that usually have illegal tags, (usually stolen), no insurance, multiple arrests for DUI, attached tags unassigned and related to accidents that leave legal, taxpaying citizens in pain, physically and financially.
    Third, Most live in mobile homes or apartments or motels.  Usually with more people than the units are designed to accommodate.
    Fourth, they leave the residences trashed, uninhabitable requiring extensive repairs, usually with the owners responsible for the repairs and refurbishing.  99% of the time they don't pay their utility bills which results in power, water turned off even though they still reside there further contributing to the unhealthy, unsanitary conditions resulting in the property being condemned.
    Judicial redress is impossible due to the unverifiable, undocumented individuals.  Most have bogus licenses, passports, work permits.  Any attempts to find redress is null and void as they just move on to another jurisdiction with new identities or those stolen from a legal, taxpaying individual(s) and start over again. (the cycle doesn't stop)
    Fifth, We, the legal, taxpaying, working , voting, citizen pays the freight!  The costs come out of our pockets!  I could go on but I hope that this will open the eyes of some of you as to the realities of illegal immigration.  There are so many more examples than those listed here.  If you are not sure or doubt my information, buy some property and rent it out to all those illegal immigrants that you want us to support.
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    nice suggestions, too bad so many politicians aren't really looking for solutions, :-)
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    The 12/5/2011 issue of USA Today carried an article regarding an illegal alien who was arrested and deported leaving a family in the United States behind. The article, written by William Welch from USA Today, declared these people should be given a route to legal status. I think that is what happens when they are deported; they are sent back to where they have legal status.
    Leaving their family behind is their choice. Welch says. “Our laws should respect families following the rules instead of splitting them apart.” The article referred to “law abiding lives”; A U.S. citizen can be jailed and remain incarcerated for a significant period of time for being a habitual criminal. The illegal alien is a habitual criminal. They become a criminal the minute they illegally enter our country and they compound that crime every day they remain here illegally.
    Gingrich suggests a family who has been living here for 20 years should be given amnesty (he says it is not amnesty but call it what ever he wants – it is still amnesty)! The only amnesty should be; Identify yourself as an illegal alien, no incarceration in the United States , return to the appropriate country, file for “legal entry” into the United States, and be given consideration along with any other person seeking legal entry. Those who fail to do this will be arrested, incarcerated until deported and not be allowed to file for legal entry for at least ten years. If caught again illegally in our country they should be incarcerated for no less than one year then deported.
    The bottom line: secure the borders AND – AT THE SAME TIME; follow our national laws. Seek out, arrest and deport ALL ILLEGALS. Fixing this mess one step at a time is nonsense. Do it all now and get it done right!
    Want to pay for it – levy huge fines on employers and communities that harbor illegal’s, seize assets gained through savings from using illegal employees, and seize property obtained by illegals while they are in the United States. We seize property of drug sellers so why not do the same with illegal aliens?
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    Paynattention Wrote:

    #1 Before making a judgment about my opinion, read it all and keep in mind … although my opinion may cause you to be angry and form an opinion about me, that is your right which I honor, because I believe we are all entitled to our own opinion (and so far there is no law against that).
    #2 EVEN MORE IMPORTANT than my personal opinion is the fact that when "push comes to shove", I set my personal opinion aside and make a serious effort to apply common sense, fairness, law, and the greater good for human welfare, to the decisions I make.

    Immigration to my country is a privilege, not a right … regardless of the southwestern USA having been part of Mexico, if you enter this country without permission, you are for all intents and purposes an illegal alien (illegal being the key word), so don‘t try to soften it with a title of "undocumented". You have ignored our law … that makes you a criminal and you have lost any legal advantage or opportunity to enjoy my country’s riches and benefits (which you have not earned or paid for). If your children are born here, they too are illegal aliens. If you come to this country legally, in search of a better life, you are obligated to protect it from intruders and those who would cause harm. You are obligated to help maintain and protect the standard of living this country has built, not accept a poverty wage and live in substandard conditions to get a job, or to put someone else out of theirs. Proudly and unconditionally fly the flag of this country and observe its laws or go back where you came from and change the conditions there to suit your wants and needs.

    National Origin is condition of birth ... my family and ancestors have been in this country, legally, for eleven generations, that pretty much makes me a native. I take pride in my ancestral heritage and the efforts of my ancestors, and since I am a native, my patriotic allegiance is to this country and its traditions. If you come to live in my country, accept my way of life, speak my language, declare your allegiance to this country, do not expect me to change for you. If you find that unacceptable … go back to your country of origin.

    This issue isn't just about Mexican or South American citizens, there are plenty of illegal aliens from Africa, Asia, Australia, Canada, Central America, Europe, and all those little nondescript countries. My neighbor was put out of a construction job by a non-english speaking illegal alien that will work for less than minimum wage ... now neither of them is paying taxes. Guess who's paying for their health care and food stamps and housing.


    WOW,  this is good .
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    Paynattention Wrote:

    #1 Before making a judgment about my opinion, read it all and keep in mind … although my opinion may cause you to be angry and form an opinion about me, that is your right which I honor, because I believe we are all entitled to our own opinion (and so far there is no law against that).
    #2 EVEN MORE IMPORTANT than my personal opinion is the fact that when "push comes to shove", I set my personal opinion aside and make a serious effort to apply common sense, fairness, law, and the greater good for human welfare, to the decisions I make.

    Immigration to my country is a privilege, not a right … regardless of the southwestern USA having been part of Mexico, if you enter this country without permission, you are for all intents and purposes an illegal alien (illegal being the key word), so don‘t try to soften it with a title of "undocumented". You have ignored our law … that makes you a criminal and you have lost any legal advantage or opportunity to enjoy my country’s riches and benefits (which you have not earned or paid for). If your children are born here, they too are illegal aliens. If you come to this country legally, in search of a better life, you are obligated to protect it from intruders and those who would cause harm. You are obligated to help maintain and protect the standard of living this country has built, not accept a poverty wage and live in substandard conditions to get a job, or to put someone else out of theirs. Proudly and unconditionally fly the flag of this country and observe its laws or go back where you came from and change the conditions there to suit your wants and needs.

    National Origin is condition of birth ... my family and ancestors have been in this country, legally, for eleven generations, that pretty much makes me a native. I take pride in my ancestral heritage and the efforts of my ancestors, and since I am a native, my patriotic allegiance is to this country and its traditions. If you come to live in my country, accept my way of life, speak my language, declare your allegiance to this country, do not expect me to change for you. If you find that unacceptable … go back to your country of origin.

    This issue isn't just about Mexican or South American citizens, there are plenty of illegal aliens from Africa, Asia, Australia, Canada, Central America, Europe, and all those little nondescript countries. My neighbor was put out of a construction job by a non-english speaking illegal alien that will work for less than minimum wage ... now neither of them is paying taxes. Guess who's paying for their health care and food stamps and housing.


    WOW,this should be posted everyday
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    Look, you're blaming the victim.

    Illegal immigrants would not have jobs....if employers did not hire them and/or pay them under the table.
    I worked alongside undocumented cooks/kitchen workers for years. For most, it was one of two or three jobs. Those folks worked their asses off. They would have got in line if they could, but 10,000 dollars is hard to come by, and it still takes a long time.

    Most mind you, overstay on work or school visas.

    And most in fact pay taxes. Anyone with a Social Security, real or someone else's, is paying income taxes. They are also paying sales taxes. And if they don't get any SSA or Medicare benefits, because they're contributing to someone else's number, they are reducing expenditures, and they also can't get an income tax return. Not without massive fraud...that's likely to draw huge red flags, if several people submit tax returns on same Social Security number.

    But there's spending on illegal immigration (healthcare, crime, other social services)....that's a problem. But what do you expect when you have a political-economic system that relegates people to the shadows? I'm not saying undocumented who commit crimes are somehow justified or removed from responsibility for their actions. I am not trying to wax philosophical nonsense here. I'm saying that you got a system that victimizes the good with the bad.