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Impeach or no.

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    Chet Ruminski Wrote:

    Dave said:

    "Could Bernie have delivered more votes than Clinton? Probably. But the mindset was that the D's could not lose, so that was no longer a deciding factor in that internal election."

    That contradicts that a party will overlook flaws. Hillary was flawless to the DNC and the DNC had absolutely nobody else in mind besides Hillary. I myself started posting early in 2015 that Hillary could lose. I said the Democratic party had lost touch with the working class and they couldn't identify the problems of the working class because it would call into question the 2 eight year terms of Clinton and Obama.

    Chet: If the party really wanted Hillary as its candidate, it would have found ways to shut Bernie down much earlier. The party did allow the democratic process to carry through to its final conclusion.

    As far the DNC believing Ms. Clinton was flawless, I kind of doubt that. That interview with Ms. Clinton gloating over the execution of Gadaffi was enough to turn many people away from her. It would be folly the power brokers did not see the effect of that interview.

    I believe, rather, that the DNC believed it could not lose against Mr. Trump. Ms. Clinton was calling in favors, and the playing field was tilted in her way. If she won the presidency, favors could be returned. That is how the system works. This tilting happens a lot in internal party elections--even in Canada.

    If you don't like that, then consider another system of governance where favors are not promised and paid back.

    I am predicting both Houses flipping to the D side in November. Whether that leads to an impeachment or not, I cannot say. It would more prudent for the anti-Trump forces to wait for 2020 rather than start an impeachment. The T approval needs to drop to 20% before the public will really get behind the impeachment process.

    Regardless, I'm not sure the D party has learned its lesson. It will again believe that it can defeat Mr. Trump in 2020----and proffer up a dead dog as its presidential candidate. If you don't like that possibility, then consider another system of governance.

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    Dave said:

    "Regardless, I'm not sure the D party has learned its lesson"

    Much like defeating Sadam. Celebrated victory but had not a clue what to do with the victory. For whatever reason the DNC is still not recognizing that Trump won the election recognizing the people left behind. The working class. Relishing the idea that any Democrat could win in 2020 it will seem like every Democrat is running. The country has a big problem and if needs impeachment to solve it. We owe it to our kids ( grand and great grand) to impeach Trump just to show them that a bold faced chronic habitual liar will get kicked out of the White House !!!

  • Are you sure you want to delete this post?
        
    Chet Ruminski Wrote:

    Dave said:

    "Regardless, I'm not sure the D party has learned its lesson"

    Much like defeating Sadam. Celebrated victory but had not a clue what to do with the victory. For whatever reason the DNC is still not recognizing that Trump won the election recognizing the people left behind. The working class. Relishing the idea that any Democrat could win in 2020 it will seem like every Democrat is running. The country has a big problem and if needs impeachment to solve it. We owe it to our kids ( grand and great grand) to impeach Trump just to show them that a bold faced chronic habitual liar will get kicked out of the White House !!!

    This is probably good reason for the impeachment. However, all politicians cannot be completely honest. There are always reasons to keep certain things hidden from the public. The better politicians know how express political expediency. For sure, Mr. Trump has taken the lying to a new extreme.

    But the Trump base is not buying into any impeachment. With 30% of the population believing that all this turmoil is a witch hunt, going through an impeachment can be dangerous to keep the country together. Better to have a very decisive election in 2020.

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    Ranking house democrat Adam Schiff on MTP is looking like he might start legal proceedings against trump when democrats take over the house in 2019, a step in the correct direction, IMO.

    msn.com/en-us/news/us/schiff-if-trumps-...

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    Dockadams Wrote:

    Ranking house democrat Adam Schiff on MTP is looking like he might start legal proceedings against trump when democrats take over the house in 2019, a step in the correct direction, IMO.

    msn.com/en-us/news/us/schiff-if-trumps-...

    Schiff will be able to conduct investigations into whether Trump or any of his associates conspired with the Russian government in 2016, but it will be left to incoming House Judiciary Chairman Jerry Nadler and the rest of the House Judiciary Committee to determine if they should open impeachment proceedings.

    I'm actually kind of torn about beginning impeachment proceedings against Donald. On one hand, I believe in the rule of law and the idea that no individual is above it. On the other, I can see impeachment proceedings actually being beneficial to Donald in the same way they were beneficial to Clinton. If Democrats are successfully portrayed as overstepping (which Fox "News" and the right-wing media will certainly put all of their resources into convincing Americans they are) then that could be catastrophic for our chances to unseat Donald at the ballot box in 2020.

    Impeachment is a political process, not a legal one. Sure, the House can impeach Donald with a simple majority, but every Democrat and twenty Republicans would have to vote to convict and remove him from office. That is highly unlikely no matter how serious his crimes are.

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    jaredsxtn Wrote:
    Dockadams Wrote:

    Ranking house democrat Adam Schiff on MTP is looking like he might start legal proceedings against trump when democrats take over the house in 2019, a step in the correct direction, IMO.

    msn.com/en-us/news/us/schiff-if-trumps-...

    Schiff will be able to conduct investigations into whether Trump or any of his associates conspired with the Russian government in 2016, but it will be left to incoming House Judiciary Chairman Jerry Nadler and the rest of the House Judiciary Committee to determine if they should open impeachment proceedings.

    I'm actually kind of torn about beginning impeachment proceedings against Donald. On one hand, I believe in the rule of law and the idea that no individual is above it. On the other, I can see impeachment proceedings actually being beneficial to Donald in the same way they were beneficial to Clinton. If Democrats are successfully portrayed as overstepping (which Fox "News" and the right-wing media will certainly put all of their resources into convincing Americans they are) then that could be catastrophic for our chances to unseat Donald at the ballot box in 2020.

    Impeachment is a political process, not a legal one. Sure, the House can impeach Donald with a simple majority, but every Democrat and twenty Republicans would have to vote to convict and remove him from office. That is highly unlikely no matter how serious his crimes are.

    The House Judiciary Committee can also delve into Trump's financial records too by use of a subpoena using all kinds of probable cause reasons.

    I know you're saying that the odds and numbers are stacked against presidential impeachment, but the Mueller investigation may grind on into 2020 too. If that happens, and as things get worse than they are now for Trump, and if democrats don't make any stupid mistakes, Trump might not be electable in 2020, Americans, 62% of them presently believe Trump isn't being truthful, that might hurt his reelection chances. If that happens, he could be indicted after he leaves office in another person is elected to office. I'd like to see Trump ousted asap, but I would settle for a indictment/s after he's out of office. Until that happens, let's hope he doesn't cause any more damage to America than he already has.

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    Dockadams Wrote: I know you're saying that the odds and numbers are stacked against presidential impeachment, but the Mueller investigation may grind on into 2020 too. If that happens, and as things get worse than they are now for Trump, and if democrats don't make any stupid mistakes, Trump might not be electable in 2020, Americans, 62% of them presently believe Trump isn't being truthful, that might hurt his reelection chances. If that happens, he could be indicted after he leaves office in another person is elected to office. I'd like to see Trump ousted asap, but I would settle for a indictment/s after he's out of office. Until that happens, let's hope he doesn't cause any more damage to America than he already has.

    I actually think Democrats can inflict maximum damage on Donald even without removing him from office. Expect big investigations led by Rep. Schiff on the Intelligence Committee, Rep. Nadler on the Judiciary Committee, Rep. Waters on the Financial Services Committee, and Rep. Cummings on the Oversight Committee, just to name a few.

    Donald is going to have a rude awakening come January 3rd. Gone are the days of his Republican lapdogs protecting him from rigorous oversight. Everything he's ever touched as a businessman is fair game and he's touched a whole lot of things. He might find out that being President is the worst thing that's ever happened to him and his business ventures.

    Democrats will be able to inflict maximum damage on Donald even if he's not impeached and removed from office. We're still screwed when it comes to federal judges because the Senate will fast track every nominee he nominates and Democrats won't be able to do a damn thing about it, but at least we can breath easy that he and his Republican lapdogs will no longer be able to ram through far-right legislation with impunity.