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Can Trump legal directly Fire Mueller himself?

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  • Independent
    Washington
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    factcheck.org/2017/06/can-trump-fire-mu...

    The answer is yes he can fire Mueller himlself, but not easily as he would like to think.

    On MSNBC, former US attorney Chuck Rosenberg explained that trump has the power to legally fire Mueller because it is only a DOJ "Regulation" that sets up the current parameters for firing a SP. Its not a law. trump has the power to order the elimination of any federal regulation.

    If trump wants to fire Mueller himself, he would first order that the current DOJ regulation to be removed. This would take some time to occur (aka, can't happen over night, or concurrently). There would be enough time for congress to block Mueller's firing.

  • Independent
    Washington
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    Doubtful that trump will directly fire Mueller. Trump doesn't want to be holding the symbolic gun that assassinates Mueller, trump wants to put someone in place that knows, without being told, that Mueller must go immediately. trump then can claim:

    "I had nothing to do with it, ask XXX why he fired Mueller. I have no idea why. I guess maybe Mueller was committing horrible crimes and needs to be investigated, maybe that is what is being planned, but don't ask me, I don't know anything about it, I know nothing. I am innocent of everything! there was no collusion, it was a witch hunt!"

  • Center Left
    Independent
    Central, FL
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    Citizens should protest in many ways if it was to happen. You may have some domestic chaos on the nightly news.
  • Independent
    Washington
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    TJ Wrote: Citizens should protest in many ways if it was to happen. You may have some domestic chaos on the nightly news.

    That would probably help if were a sustained effort.

    What is strange about what you suggest, given trump's personality, the more people protest and get angry, the more he is likely to feel validated that he made the right decision. Seriously, for trump being "destructive" is like having sex, the more destructive his actions have on others, the better the orgasm. That is just the way he is wired. Inflicting failure on others = feels good.

  • Liberal Democrat
    Democrat
    Kenosha, WI
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    wwjd Wrote:

    factcheck.org/2017/06/can-trump-fire-mu...

    The answer is yes he can fire Mueller himlself, but not easily as he would like to think.

    On MSNBC, former US attorney Chuck Rosenberg explained that trump has the power to legally fire Mueller because it is only a DOJ "Regulation" that sets up the current parameters for firing a SP. Its not a law. trump has the power to order the elimination of any federal regulation.

    If trump wants to fire Mueller himself, he would first order that the current DOJ regulation to be removed. This would take some time to occur (aka, can't happen over night, or concurrently). There would be enough time for congress to block Mueller's firing.

    No, not exactly correct. Deputy attorney general Rosenstein has that authority. Since Jeff Sessions recused himself from the Russia witch hunt, it's Rosenstein's call. Although the raid on Cohen's office/apartment/whatever you want to call it, the FBI looking for evidence of bank fraud, campaign contribution irregularities, paid whore/s evidence, and the like, this may not even be a part of a Russia witch hunt, it may be just ordinary everyday fraud or illegal activities.
  • Independent
    Washington
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    Dockadams Wrote:
    wwjd Wrote:

    factcheck.org/2017/06/can-trump-fire-mu...

    The answer is yes he can fire Mueller himlself, but not easily as he would like to think.

    On MSNBC, former US attorney Chuck Rosenberg explained that trump has the power to legally fire Mueller because it is only a DOJ "Regulation" that sets up the current parameters for firing a SP. Its not a law. trump has the power to order the elimination of any federal regulation.

    If trump wants to fire Mueller himself, he would first order that the current DOJ regulation to be removed. This would take some time to occur (aka, can't happen over night, or concurrently). There would be enough time for congress to block Mueller's firing.

    No, not exactly correct. Deputy attorney general Rosenstein has that authority. Since Jeff Sessions recused himself from the Russia witch hunt, it's Rosenstein's call.

    Yes, that is how the regulation states it should work. Its just a regulation, not a law. Legally trump could order that the regulation be removed. If he removed it, then he could directly fire Mueller.

    The good news is that this is not a realistic possibility. I am just pointing out that most people assume trump can't legally do it because of US law; he is only blocked by a single regulation, which is a much lower bar than if it were a law. trump's attorney may also argue that the regulation is not legal under the constitution.

  • Strongly Liberal Democrat
    Democrat
    Portland, OR
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    Honestly, nothing would surprise me anymore. Mueller, and now the Southern District of New York, are getting closer and closer to Donald and "a cornered rat will bite the cat."

    Donald may very well move to fire Mueller either directly or indirectly by firing Rosenstein or Sessions (Sessions replacement could theoretically take over supervising the Special Counsel), but either of those actions would surely spark a Constitutional crisis that Donald may not be prepared for.

    If Donald tried to directly fire Mueller then there would surely be a lawsuit filed in Federal court. Whether or not the people who file the suit have "standing" will play a big part in that court battle. Courts may very well rule that whoever filed the lawsuit doesn't have standing, so whoever files it will have to be very careful.

    If Donald fired Rosenstein or Sessions then their replacements would require Senate approval, which is no guarantee considering there two Republicans on record (and hopefully more off the record) that said firing Rosenstein would be political suicide for Donald.

    The same goes if he fires FBI Director Wrayor any other top brass appointee at the DOJ and FBI. I could totally see a "Saturday Night Massacre" scenario where Donald fires everyone until he finds someone to be his lapdog, but he may want to look into how that worked out for Nixon in the long run.


    Mueller made a brilliant decision in referring Cohen's case to the Southern District of New York. They have different jurisdiction than the Special Counsel while at the same time he ensured that the investigations into Donald will go on no matter what Donald does or doesn't do with the Special Counsel.

    I was also pleasantly surprised to hear that Donald's hand picked U.S. Attorney in charge of the Southern District of New York recused himself from the Cohen case. That probably hit Donald the hardest because he chose Geoffrey Berman after taking the unusual step of personally interviewing him. Donald must have surely thought Berman was going to protect him, but Berman actually appears to have a conscious and decided to put country over loyalty to Donald.