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Florida High School mass shooting

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    Schools today, Walmart, large churches or the movie theater tomorrow. Many soft targets.

    Arming teachers ? What next ? Students with a 9mm and 3 extra clips ? Welcome to the first grade Billy. Make sure your safety is on.

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    Schmidt Wrote:

    Getting rid of the 2nd Amendment has about as much reality as North Korea putting a man on Mars. It's pointless to even discuss "solutions" that have zero chance of happening. So why don't we discuss a realistic path forward that deals with the reality...63 million people voted for Trump in 2016 and Republicans control all THREE branches of government plus the state governorships and state legislatures.

    Republicans control 239 of the 435 House of the Representatives seats. Dems control 193, Independents 1.

    Republicans control the Senate with 51 members. Democrats have 47 seats and Independents 2.

    Republicans control a record 67 state legislatures, more than twice the number (31) than the Democrats.

    Republicans control 33 of 50 state governorships.

    Conservatives control the Supreme Court, 5-4.

    And of course Republicans control the Executive branch.

    So all these wish lists of what Democrats should, could, would do to change the Constitution are just that...feel good wish lists. Nothing to do with reality.

    It takes a super majority (67 percent) of both the House and the Senate plus 75 percent of all state legislatures to pass an amendment to the Constitution or otherwise change or rewrite it in any way. It ain't going to happen.

    The Supreme Court has the ultimate say in differing interpretations of the various clauses and amendments of the Constitution. And SCOTUS is very much is a conservative court now. If Roe v Wade is brought to the court again as a challenge is some form, it too could be scuttled, especially so if Trump gets one more court pick.

    This is reality. And that reality will not change no matter how enraged we get or how many marches and protests we make or how much we want to castigate the DNC, Tony Rerez, Nancy Pelosi, Chuck Schumer or the Clintons or who ever is there to cast blame at. The only way we can incrementally change that reality is vote in 2018 and 2020.

    If Democratic voters follow the same course of the 2010 and 2014 midterm elections and go fishing on election day, then that reality will not change.

    Yes Schmidt, you hit the nail on the "head". Indeed this country refuses to become "normal" as other civil countries.

    I've said enough about what is wrong and how to fix it; so if the "will" is not there, then this country will indeed end up as Venezuela. I guess every one here hopefully agrees that our silly 2 party government is "broken" due to refusing to adapt/design proper laws in just about all area's. Love those "guns" as well the "military" and our "wars as well "corruption" on all levels; that will help for sure. Thus Schmidt, let's stick our heads in the sand and run like hell towards the cliff; sounds like a great solution.

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    Agreed that there is no chance that altering the 2nd Amendment is a realistic option. Not now, and not within our life time.

    My realistic side believes no change will occur while trump is president. Today trump suggested that teachers become fully armed with military\police gear and be trained as as such. That is no more realistic as the far left suggestion to remove the 2nd Amendment.

    Status: Stalemate. NRA wins all stalemates.

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    This should be ultimately settled at the by voting. Massive voter registration should be a priority. Accountability. Every politician can be replaced.
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    TJ Wrote: This should be ultimately settled at the by voting. Massive voter registration should be a priority. Accountability. Every politician can be replaced.

    I agree. This won't be settled before the mid terms. By this time March 1st, this topic will have faded from the national attention; trump will do various shit drawing everyone's attention back to him. It is in in DNA so-t0-speak; he has a very deep seeded need be the center of attention at all time. IMHO, he is jealous of the attention anyone\everyone who gets more than him, including children who are victims of mass shooting. He might be able to hold it back for a very limited period, but the longer he hold back his jealously, the larger the backlash that follows (ie tweet storms). It redirected at others issue or people, but at the core is his need to be at center 100% of the time.

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    Looking at the speakers at CPAC as shown on MSNBC, I had to run to get the barf bucket. How come that this country has become so awfully "nuts"? Let's hope someone shoots La Pierre and his cronies. They are worse than the Hitler "braunshirts"

    Then you have the "congress" "filth" including Trump who got huge "handouts" from this "criminal" institution.

    Just keep these assault riffles on the "street" with their "gut ripping bullets" as were used on innocent children.

    And no one is ashamed or takes "real" action, except arming the teachers to make things even worse; Just "prayers" will be the "cure all"

    Just stick to an "old" dumb antique piece of "paper" and murder for it.

    Yes this country is doomed for sure; "common" sense does not live here.

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    We need a leader with a single message. Respect the people and dump all the right wing propaganda about self determination. Work hard and you can be or accomplish anything creates a majority of disillusioned disappointed dejected people in a state of chaos. That gives power to the self centered opportunistic authoritarians. One message one voice. Somebody to rally behind.

    But is it too late to fall inline???

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    There are reports that there was a police officer that arrived during the shooting, but did not enter the building. trump and others are calling him by his full name, a coward who did not do his job.

    Before we jump to the same conclusions.

    What was he trained to do?
    Was he given orders to wait for backup or do something specific?
    What did he actually know at that point in time?

    Is waiting for backup as trained, a sign of a coward?

    Maybe he did not follow his training and\or was told to enter the building, but remained outside. Bottom line we don't know either way. I bet if he knew that if there was gun fire in the school, the reason he outside the building wasn't because he was a coward hoping nobody would shoot him.

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    trump recommendation: Train teachers to become armed professionals

    If this recommend was put into place. This is how I see different parts of the country implementing such a change to arm teachers.

    Alabama State: Requirement that teachers to carry weapons at all times and are held responsible for all shooter injuries\deaths that occur at the school.

    Washington state: Not recommend, Not endorsed, Not implemented. Other non gun related solutions are put into place.

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    wwjd Wrote:

    trump recommendation: Train teachers to become armed professionals

    If this recommend was put into place. This is how I see different parts of the country implementing such a change to arm teachers.

    Alabama State: Requirement that teachers to carry weapons at all times and are held responsible for all shooter injuries\deaths that occur at the school.

    Washington state: Not recommend, Not endorsed, Not implemented. Other non gun related solutions are put into place.

    Ridiculous!!! If you don't get rid of the "cause" then "band aids" will not solve anything; the "murders" on the street and communities will continue as well. Nothing will change; if you get shot by an 18 year old or by an 21 year old, what is the difference? Also if nothing is done about the ammunition of these guns ( it blows your "guts" to shreds) then what is the use of all this "stupid" talk. Teachers should teach and concentrate on that only. Guns don't belong in schools, period.
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    I think the vast majority of people...parents, teachers, and students are against arming teachers. Guns of any kind do not belong in schools. The idea just has not been thought through, except by the NRA in that it will enhance the bottom line of the gun manufacturers who are hurting now that Obama is not in office.

    However, when Trump gets an idea in his brain, he won't back off.

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    TJ Wrote:

    Schools today, Walmart, large churches or the movie theater tomorrow. Many soft targets.

    Arming teachers ? What next ? Students with a 9mm and 3 extra clips ? Welcome to the first grade Billy. Make sure your safety is on.

    Meh, my Walmart already has one of those prowlers, you'll see him occasionally walking about the aisles with his second amendment strapped on his hip, he ain't a cop, he ain't a security guard, he ain't paid by anyone, he's just a dickhead showing everyone who sees him to not fuck with him or anyone in the store, because he's there to stop eeeevil. LOL. Look for more of that since Lepieeere came out and said the only thing that stops a bad guy wit a gun is a good guy wit a gun, yeah, right, like the security guard in Florida who stood by while the school was being shot to hell. /eyeroll
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    Dockadams Wrote:
    Meh, my Walmart already has one of those prowlers, you'll see him occasionally walking about the aisles with his second amendment strapped on his hip, he ain't a cop, he ain't a security guard, he ain't paid by anyone, he's just a dickhead showing everyone who sees him to not fuck with him or anyone in the store, because he's there to stop eeeevil. LOL. Look for more of that since Lepieeere came out and said the only thing that stops a bad guy wit a gun is a good guy wit a gun, yeah, right, like the security guard in Florida who stood by while the school was being shot to hell. /eyeroll

    This is incredibly naive.

    "he's just a dickhead showing everyone who sees him to not fuck with him or anyone in the store, because he's there to stop eeeevil. LOL."

    First of all, a large majority of CCW (conceal carriers) DO NOT like open carry, including myself. We generally see it as showing off and unnecessary. But that doesn't mean they are all "dickheads". They are legally exercising their right to do so. Just as you exercise your right to do whatever you want today. Do you fear the "dickheads" open carrying? Are they causing you bodily harm? I would assume probably not. Because it's NOT the open carriers that are going on these shooting sprees. Yes, they may look silly sometimes, but who cares?

    Who are you to say that he/she hasn't "stopped eeeevil" before? Do you know for sure that that person wasn't in the right place at the right time when an attacker called it off because they saw someone was armed? It's a small chance, but it's still a chance. You or I couldn't possibly know that. So why make fun of them?

    What would you do if you were in this exact situation? Locked down in a classroom/gas station/grocery store/whatever, when a gunman came in and was slowly picking people off. Now say a genie appeared and offered you a firearm. Would you accept the firearm or not? This is obviously hypothetical, but I think it's a very fair question. Sounds to me like you wouldn't take the firearm because you wouldn't want to look stupid or you'd rather wait for someone else to figure it out.

    The security guard at the school was a coward. He should have helped. But just because he didn't help does NOT mean all other security guards, police officers, concealed carriers, open carriers would do the same. There have been many cases where a security guard or ccw has saved lives by simply pulling their firearm. And oh yeah, there's also been maybe one or two cases where police have used their firearms to take down gunmen and saved lives. But who cares about that, right? According to you, anyone carrying a firearm is grouped in with this security guard. Lets just ignore facts and stick with LOLs and /eyerolls.

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    Eye rolls are protected by the 1st amendment. Enjoy your feeling of safety while you're armed.
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    ClayTaylorNC Wrote:
    Dockadams Wrote:
    Meh, my Walmart already has one of those prowlers, you'll see him occasionally walking about the aisles with his second amendment strapped on his hip, he ain't a cop, he ain't a security guard, he ain't paid by anyone, he's just a dickhead showing everyone who sees him to not fuck with him or anyone in the store, because he's there to stop eeeevil. LOL. Look for more of that since Lepieeere came out and said the only thing that stops a bad guy wit a gun is a good guy wit a gun, yeah, right, like the security guard in Florida who stood by while the school was being shot to hell. /eyeroll

    This is incredibly naive.

    "he's just a dickhead showing everyone who sees him to not fuck with him or anyone in the store, because he's there to stop eeeevil. LOL."

    First of all, a large majority of CCW (conceal carriers) DO NOT like open carry, including myself. We generally see it as showing off and unnecessary. But that doesn't mean they are all "dickheads". They are legally exercising their right to do so. Just as you exercise your right to do whatever you want today. Do you fear the "dickheads" open carrying? Are they causing you bodily harm? I would assume probably not. Because it's NOT the open carriers that are going on these shooting sprees. Yes, they may look silly sometimes, but who cares?

    Who are you to say that he/she hasn't "stopped eeeevil" before? Do you know for sure that that person wasn't in the right place at the right time when an attacker called it off because they saw someone was armed? It's a small chance, but it's still a chance. You or I couldn't possibly know that. So why make fun of them?

    What would you do if you were in this exact situation? Locked down in a classroom/gas station/grocery store/whatever, when a gunman came in and was slowly picking people off. Now say a genie appeared and offered you a firearm. Would you accept the firearm or not? This is obviously hypothetical, but I think it's a very fair question. Sounds to me like you wouldn't take the firearm because you wouldn't want to look stupid or you'd rather wait for someone else to figure it out.

    The security guard at the school was a coward. He should have helped. But just because he didn't help does NOT mean all other security guards, police officers, concealed carriers, open carriers would do the same. There have been many cases where a security guard or ccw has saved lives by simply pulling their firearm. And oh yeah, there's also been maybe one or two cases where police have used their firearms to take down gunmen and saved lives. But who cares about that, right? According to you, anyone carrying a firearm is grouped in with this security guard. Lets just ignore facts and stick with LOLs and /eyerolls.

    Oh paaaaleeese, none of these ccw or open carry asswipes are never, ever, in the right place at the right time. Furthermore, please show me and this forum some statistics that PROVE that good people with guns stop bad guys or bad people with guns. I'll give you a clue, there aren't any, as in, there aren't any of those situations. If there is or if there are, it's only once or a few a year. Please show some stats that prove more guns would be the answer to gun problems. There ain't none of those either, except a higher rate of self inflicted homicides and suicides, and domestic argument shootings. The answer is not more guns, and it most certainly is not having armed people in schools, malls, and stores.

    I used to frequent a local laundry to wash my clothes, the proprietor's buddy was in the business establishment on a daily basis, he is a CCW person, it is evident by the large bulge under his t shirt. I approached him once and asked him why he carries a firearm, his answer was simplistic, as most people who carry openly or concealed, it was "because I can". What a ridiculous reason for wanting to carry a gun.

    There are quite a few of these per year though:

    detroit.cbslocal.com/2013/12/27/man-gra...

    "Authorities say a Livingston County man accidentally shot himself while shopping at a home improvement store with the gun he was legally carrying.

    The incident happened around 6 p.m. Thursday at the Home Depot in Brighton, near I-96 and Grand River Avenue.

    Police say the 32-year-old Green Oak Township man, who was not named, was apparently reaching into his pocket for his wallet when he inadvertently grabbed his pistol and a shot fired, striking him in the buttocks."