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Meuller issues charges

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  • Strongly Liberal
    Independent
    Ohio
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    The first charges have been issued by the grand jury , Meuller and the federal judge who has sealed the warrant for now. We are awaiting the arrest to find out who it is. Meanwhile , senator Fienstien has sent five letters ordering all records from Cambridge analitika, Michel Cohen, Facebook, specifically talking about every character involved the entire crime family the Russians the Russian banks all of it. Shit is about to get real , Nov 6 ,is the deadline.

    So now we see. Will the rule of law prevail ? Is this a coup and will the evil ones attempt to proceed with it , will they run ? How does the government function ? Constitutional crisis anyone ?

  • Liberal Democrat
    Democrat
    Colorado Springs, CO
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    This will drag out. However, a constitutional crisis will be upon us if Trump pardons all the perps before they can testify or tries to fire Mueller. Not sure how that works though if the firing or pardons are seen as obstruction of justice.
  • Independent
    Washington
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    Schmidt Wrote: This will drag out. However, a constitutional crisis will be upon us if Trump pardons all the perps before they can testify or tries to fire Mueller. Not sure how that works though if the firing or pardons are seen as obstruction of justice.

    ATM, what i find suspicious that the trump is remaining surprising quite\calm. He is only that way when he knows something that is to his advantage. Given he is president, he will have a truck load of inside info about what is happening behind the scenes, and likely knows more about the mueller investigation that has yet to be made public. I suspect if he were aware of bad shit about to come down connected directly to him, he would be freaking out on Twitter. So far he has not, maybe he knows his pardon powers are akin to dropping nukes on countries who have none. Since there is little or no defense to his ability to pardon anyone\everyone he wants, he may feel that nothing can be done to stop him from pardoning people in advance who need a get a get-out-jail-free card in order to remain lowyal\silent (ie back channel agreement already made). We can easily assme he will use that his power to paradon for his self-interest (it is nature to abuse power ) to protect people who have damaging info about trump (and family). Key insiders are likely been informed somehow "trump has your back 100% as long as you remain on his team, he will paradon you. However, if he feels betrayed, he will double down against you"

  • Independent
    Washington
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    My predictions are #1 Manafort, and #2 Micheal Flynn

    My hope is that who ever it is, it is as close to trump as possible, and guilty. Love it to be trump or bannon, but extremely unlikely. If it is Flynn, he is likely to have a lot dirt on trump.

  • Liberal Democrat
    Democrat
    Colorado Springs, CO
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    Yes...Manafort and Flynn are at the top of the list. It may come down to how complete the investigations are. Manafort will be indicted, but if there are some parts of the investigations against him that are not yet tidied up, then his indictment might wait.

    Flynn then moves to the top of the list. His case may be easier to close.

    Personally, I would like to see him indict Kushner or Trump Jr. to send a message that the investigation is dead serious and that charges of collusion are still "on the table" ready to be served.

  • Independent
    Ft.myers, FL
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    Schmidt Wrote:

    Yes...Manafort and Flynn are at the top of the list. It may come down to how complete the investigations are. Manafort will be indicted, but if there are some parts of the investigations against him that are not yet tidied up, then his indictment might wait.

    Flynn then moves to the top of the list. His case may be easier to close.

    Personally, I would like to see him indict Kushner or Trump Jr. to send a message that the investigation is dead serious and that charges of collusion are still "on the table" ready to be served.

    Yes Schmidt I agree; I hope it will be Kussner; But starting to know this country and its hype; it could be the White House mailman or chambermaid.
  • Independent
    Washington
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    My perception of trump is that he stays within legal boundaries, but has no ethics in how he conducts himself personally\professionally.

    I doubt that trump will ever be directly connected with criminal activities, but its likely that many people closest to him, and those who he had business relationships, have shady backgrounds.

    Example. If his tax returns are ever released\leaked. My prediction is that his taxes pass legal audits, but there will be shit load of business transactions with shady people\businesses and exploitation of tax loop holes. trump has a carpetbagger mentality, and if he could, he would be selling water in puerto rico at a price high than gold. Not illegal, but clearly unethical. It is that kind if crap that had made him a rich man at the expense of others, I think his tax return would expose it.

    Mueller can't charge trump with crimes for being an unethical human being who preys on those who are victims of circumstances they can't control (storms, laid off, born a minority, dreamers, etc), and I doubt that Mueller can even make a statement that suggests trump is innocent of legal crimes, but a very unethical person who has made a career of fucking over people. Mueller simply has to stick to facts, even if the facts suggest trump has no ethics\morality.

  • Liberal Democrat
    Democrat
    Kenosha, WI
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    Alex, I'll take Ham Sandwich for $200 please.

    1. executive privilege

    2. pardon powers

    3. the 5th. amendment

    not necessarily in that order

  • Independent
    Ft.myers, FL
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    This is how it ends; enjoy!!

    l.php

  • Independent
    Washington
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    Let's hope that Manafort has a lot of dirt on trump he is willing to trade to save himself. It remains to be seen if he holds out hoping that trump gives him a pardon.

    My speculation is that trump will remain neutral on twitter waiting to see if Manafort decides to stay on the trump's team. I'm guessing Manafort has already been offered a pardon by trump if Manafort keeps his mouth shut. Thus, it will come down to what the Feds offer Manafort vs trump's paradon. The decision comes down to bet on trump or not; will trump go down in history as the great president, or the worst... If I were advising Manafort, take the Fed's deal, otherwise the Feds will get him once trump is out of office.

  • Liberal Democrat
    Democrat
    Colorado Springs, CO
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    Oh most certainly the worst president. As you stated, his defense might come down to putting the blame on all his aides and legal advisors. The "I am very smart president" might plead a "I know nothing" defense. And to be honest, it might work. For many knowledgeable people in their respective fields, Trump is a buffoon, a "dumb shit" who is able to con people by his authoritarian style of confident denial. When he pleads to being dumb, they'll believe him.

    In any case, nothing in the Manafort indictment mentions Donald Trump. Trump may be brought up later under obstruction of justice charges.

  • Independent
    Ft.myers, FL
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    Manafort is only a small fish; but his money laundering and tax evasion could be applied to Trump the same way, as well Kussner. I think the main point is Trumps tax returns; I think that he has not paid taxes for a long time,with the excuse it is under audit; which is a cover up. So even Mueller did not get those either because he likely never filed these returns. He made sure to cover the money trail as well did Kussner. So my guess is that Mueller tries via Manafort to find info on how Trump did hide his money laundering etc.
  • Liberal Democrat
    Democrat
    Colorado Springs, CO
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    Yes, what Trump fears most in my opinion is that the many secrets of his Trump organization dealings way in the past and present are exposed, and perhaps showing that he does not have the wealth that he claims. If he is exposed for hiding his true financial worth to lenders, his whole Trump empire could come crashing down in a hurry with bank foreclosures, lawsuits, and maybe even indictments. That would be a scenario worse than being impeached.

    Before any of that happened though, look for Trump to try again and fire Muller as well as issuing pardons to all the perps.

  • Liberal Democrat
    Democrat
    Colorado Springs, CO
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    With respect to the money laundering charge, we should not forget that legalized money laundering exists with campaign finance contributions through pacs and superpacs.

    Center for Public Integrity: Comeback for 'legalized money laundering' in party politics?

    Both Democrats and Republicans do it because it is legal. It is legal because the Supreme Court made them legal.

    So when Mueller brings charges of money laundering against Trump aides or Trump himself, those members of Congress who have so benefited by the money laundering through SuperPacs may make a big yawn and say...sooo?

  • Liberal Democrat
    Democrat
    Colorado Springs, CO
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    Another significant development is that former Trump advisor on foreign policy, George Papadopoulos, has pleaded guilty to lying to the FBI about his contacts with the Russians. The fact that he has pleaded guilty suggests he is cooperating with the Mueller team. It also sends notice to others in the Trump administration that lying to the FBI will get a jail sentence.

    If I were on Trump's team I would start sweating about covering up for all the Trump lies. Maybe they will all go down in one way or another when the last wheels of justice are finished rolling in this American self made nightmare.

    Unless they are all pardoned, of course.