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Trump Lies

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    This administration is already discriminating against LGBT, even without Pence being president, it's also discriminating against Latinos and other minorities too. The admin. is appealing to all those crackers.
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    Said on tv that it is not illegal for Trump to lie to the press. What about the people?
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    wwjd Wrote:

    My original point was that a majority of elected Republications officials (and republican voters) do not like Trump, do not trust Trump, and do not respect Trump, but they are willing to use him because he will sign any bill put in front of him.

    I believe the democrats would do the same if the tables had been turned, and Trump ran as democrat and won. Democrats would be sitting back tolerating the exact same crap as long as he signed democratic legislation.

    I agree in part. Tribalism amongst both Republicans and Democrats seems to take the place of any kind of independent thinking. However, I think Republicans are more ruthless than Democrats. Democrats would be less likely to support Trump on many issues if the tables were turned and by now would have probably cut the cord. Plus they like to apply purity tests to their candidates and office holders.

    Look how many Democrats were willing to throw Obama under the bus in the 2014 election. One of them is my ex-Senator who lost to Cory Gardner.

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    I agree with much that has been said, and this is a good conversation.

    The thing about Trump that I wonder most about is how and why his original supporters can justify continuing to support him even though by now they cannot deny Trump is breaking campaign promises right and left. But in spite of that Trump's middle class and poor supporters continue to support him, rationalizing that somehow their hero knows what he is doing and that it is in their best interests.

    We know, of course, that Trump serves in his own interests first, and then in the interests of other billionaires and powerful people who he respects. We also know that Trump's political ideology is deeply influenced and formulated by Bannon's, and that their goal is the destruction of the administrative state.

    Because of that goal, it doesn't matter to them how much chaos there is. In fact, they create it deliberately, and there is a good reason why.

    Trump's outlandish and outrageous statements are designed to misdirect attention away from more important issues, and we should understand the methodology of it. In Naomi Klein's "Shock Docrtrine," she explains how and why fascists and despots indulge in it, either to exploit the chaos and confusion generated by a national crises to push through controversial policies while citizens are too emotionally and physically distracted by disasters or upheavals to mount an effective resistance, or to deliberately create a shock event, such as Trump continues to do to distract people from real issues.

    A "shock event," as Political History Professor at Boston College, Heather Cox Richardson, explains in a Facebook Post, "is unexpected and confusing and throws a society into chaos. People scramble to react to the event, usually along some fault line that those responsible for the event can widen by claiming that they alone know how to restore order. When opponents speak out, the authors of the shock event call them enemies. As society reels and tempers run high, those responsible for the shock event perform a sleight of hand to achieve their real goal, a goal they know to be hugely unpopular, but from which everyone has been distracted as they fight over the initial event "

    Richardson says, "My point today is this: unless you are the person setting it up, it is in no one's interest to play the shock event game. It is designed explicitly to divide people who might otherwise come together so they cannot stand against something its authors think they won't like. . There is no longer concerted opposition to the real goal; opposition divides along the partisan lines established by the shock event." Furthermore, Richardson says "If people realize they are being played, though, they can reach across old lines and reorganize to challenge the leaders who are pulling the strings."

    Our task, therefore, is to help people understand why Trump and Bannon are doing this, so that their strategy becomes less affective. For all Americans need to understand why they want to rule, and why they are working so hard behind the scenes to dismantle our government

    Oh, and by the way, of course not all of Trump's lies are part of that "shock" strategy. In fact, most of Trump's lies are indeed "natural" since during most of his life he has been surrounded by those who served his interests and agreed with everything he said. Therefore Trump is quite used to being able to tell lies with impunity and get away with it. But all lies are eventually exposed. Eventually Trump will be completely exposed and put in his place.

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    Guy, Great post. You made some very interesting points.
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    Good analysis Guy. I read Naomi's Klein's book a few years ago and your take on how Trump is using distractions (although at a repeated smaller scale) to try advance his agenda is correct. I also read Thomas Frank's 2004 book, What's the Matter With Kansas several years ago. Thomas Frank makes note in his book that the poorest county in Kansas voted overwhelmingly for George W. Bush and Republicans.

    In the case of the Kansas poor, it wasn't a result of any shock, but rather a political shift to cultural issues...abortion, same sex marriage and such that turned much of the state from solid blue to dark red. And it didn't happen overnight. It was mostly in the messaging led by the Koch brothers who have their headquarters in Wichita.

    Democrats, of course, share the fault for losing the messaging, not only in Kansas but throughout rural America. However, there are more than just cultural issues at play here. Much of it is just propaganda from the likes of Rush Limbaugh in casting blame at the "other" for their economic decline. Like the unemployed coal miners and rust belt factory workers, they are prey to the unscrupulous politicians who cast blame and make promises they cannot keep. And yes, with the constant distractions and the media's infatuation with Trump and his lies it was hard for Hillary to get her message out.

    Also, in what would seem like a head scratcher, Christian evangelicals coalesced overwhelmingly behind Trump in the 2016 election and they voted in huge numbers. Trump represents everything most of those evangelicals are against except that he made Mike Pence as his running mate (similar to McCain selecting Sarah Palin) and he promised to elect a judge to the Supreme Court who would work to overturn Roe v. Wade. Appealing to one's emotions and moral values is a winner most of the time.

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    Some interesting insights. I am yet to be convinced that Trump is a master mind that knows exactly what he is doing in a very calculated and methodical way. What I perceive is a very immature man who has some unique communication skills that thrives in a chaotic environment. Trump feels comfortable when he is at the center of chaos. There is no master plan unfolding that is going show the world he is as great as he says. He is not getting stronger each day, he going the opposite direction in terms of influence and power. Take away his money and power, he is just a wacko. But the reality is that he is a wacko with money and power, thus is very dangerous.

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    Trump lies aren't news the real news is when he doesn't lie (and that never happens).
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    pr Wrote: Trump lies aren't news the real news is when he doesn't lie (and that never happens).

    LOL... so true. I suspect he gets a endorphin rush whenever he tells a lie, and likely would turn down great sex to tell a tall tale about having great sex ;)

    I don't want to sound sympathetic to Trump, but (IMHO) being a compulsive liar is in his generic DNA. He can't stop lying any more than he can change his eye color. Anytime he has an opportunity to tell the truth vs something-less-than-true, he always leans toward creating something that is false, even when its causes himself (and those connected to him) a lot of harm. He is like a chronic alcoholic that can't walk away from a drink\lie.

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    I don't know if this is the right place for this,but enjoy!

    trump-nyt-interview-ignorance

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    wwjd Wrote:

    Some interesting insights. I am yet to be convinced that Trump is a master mind that knows exactly what he is doing in a very calculated and methodical way. What I perceive is a very immature man who has some unique communication skills that thrives in a chaotic environment. Trump feels comfortable when he is at the center of chaos. There is no master plan unfolding that is going show the world he is as great as he says. He is not getting stronger each day, he going the opposite direction in terms of influence and power. Take away his money and power, he is just a wacko. But the reality is that he is a wacko with money and power, thus is very dangerous.

    You're talking about a manchild that has an attention span of about 20 seconds, hell, my dog pays attention longer than that! If you asked his voters in his base, they think he has a master plan to help them. No wonder his approval rating among (normal?) voters is so low. He, nor the republican controlled congress have a plan for anything, but they sure talk a good game to those who believe them, it's much like a cult.
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    More lies. He doesn't care. Doesn't pay persons hired to make his rallies look robust and spirited. When did honesty become completely unimportant ????

    news.groopspeak.com/fec-says-trump-lied...

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    TJ Wrote:

    More lies. He doesn't care. Doesn't pay persons hired to make his rallies look robust and spirited. When did honesty become completely unimportant ????

    news.groopspeak.com/fec-says-trump-lied...

    Yes that is the way it works. By the way all Republicans are actors as far as I know, or they are sniffing the same stuff as Trump.
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    Guy Dwyer Wrote:

    I agree with much that has been said, and this is a good conversation.

    The thing about Trump that I wonder most about is how and why his original supporters can justify continuing to support him even though by now they cannot deny Trump is breaking campaign promises right and left. But in spite of that Trump's middle class and poor supporters continue to support him, rationalizing that somehow their hero knows what he is doing and that it is in their best interests.

    We know, of course, that Trump serves in his own interests first, and then in the interests of other billionaires and powerful people who he respects. We also know that Trump's political ideology is deeply influenced and formulated by Bannon's, and that their goal is the destruction of the administrative state.

    Because of that goal, it doesn't matter to them how much chaos there is. In fact, they create it deliberately, and there is a good reason why.

    Trump's outlandish and outrageous statements are designed to misdirect attention away from more important issues, and we should understand the methodology of it. In Naomi Klein's "Shock Docrtrine," she explains how and why fascists and despots indulge in it, either to exploit the chaos and confusion generated by a national crises to push through controversial policies while citizens are too emotionally and physically distracted by disasters or upheavals to mount an effective resistance, or to deliberately create a shock event, such as Trump continues to do to distract people from real issues.

    A "shock event," as Political History Professor at Boston College, Heather Cox Richardson, explains in a Facebook Post, "is unexpected and confusing and throws a society into chaos. People scramble to react to the event, usually along some fault line that those responsible for the event can widen by claiming that they alone know how to restore order. When opponents speak out, the authors of the shock event call them enemies. As society reels and tempers run high, those responsible for the shock event perform a sleight of hand to achieve their real goal, a goal they know to be hugely unpopular, but from which everyone has been distracted as they fight over the initial event "

    Richardson says, "My point today is this: unless you are the person setting it up, it is in no one's interest to play the shock event game. It is designed explicitly to divide people who might otherwise come together so they cannot stand against something its authors think they won't like. . There is no longer concerted opposition to the real goal; opposition divides along the partisan lines established by the shock event." Furthermore, Richardson says "If people realize they are being played, though, they can reach across old lines and reorganize to challenge the leaders who are pulling the strings."

    Our task, therefore, is to help people understand why Trump and Bannon are doing this, so that their strategy becomes less affective. For all Americans need to understand why they want to rule, and why they are working so hard behind the scenes to dismantle our government

    Oh, and by the way, of course not all of Trump's lies are part of that "shock" strategy. In fact, most of Trump's lies are indeed "natural" since during most of his life he has been surrounded by those who served his interests and agreed with everything he said. Therefore Trump is quite used to being able to tell lies with impunity and get away with it. But all lies are eventually exposed. Eventually Trump will be completely exposed and put in his place.

    "I wonder most about is how and why his original supporters can justify continuing to support him even though by now they cannot deny Trump is breaking campaign promises right and left."

    His original supporters are like subjective cultist. They support oblivious to anything objective. The more you expose the stronger they support. It is a personal attack on their minds to try and communicate with them. They are formed in granite and won't or can't be changed. If you prove everything they believe is wrong they'll say "SO" or "are you finished".

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    wwjd Wrote:

    Some interesting insights. I wonder most about is how and why his original supporters can justify continuing to support him even though by now they cannot deny Trump is breaking campaign promises right and left. I am yet to be convinced that Trump is a master mind that knows exactly what he is doing in a very calculated and methodical way. What I perceive is a very immature man who has some unique communication skills that thrives in a chaotic environment. Trump feels comfortable when he is at the center of chaos. There is no master plan unfolding that is going show the world he is as great as he says. He is not getting stronger each day, he going the opposite direction in terms of influence and power. Take away his money and power, he is just a wacko. But the reality is that he is a wacko with money and power, thus is very dangerous.

    "I am yet to be convinced that Trump is a master mind that knows exactly what he is doing"

    He isn't . He never wanted to be President. He budgeted a certain amount of money to run and make his Brand a worldwide known top of the list topic. He didn't expect to win and nobody expected him to win. The phenomenal aspect of charisma, a compelling attraction, made him president. He could say anything he wanted and never lose the support of his subjective supporters. He spent less than half the money Hillary did. He said and did a whole campaign of atrocities of which only one would have destroyed any other candidate. And he continues to act at odds with a presidential style. The complimenting reason he won is the DNC opposed him with a candidate that had no appeal and no resonance with voteres. Trump had what should have been her campaign motto. Lots of good paying jobs and make America great again. Hillary was hamstrung by Obama. She couldn't say anything positive to the voters without it criticising Obama's presidency. The personal mandate that punished people that had no money to buy insurance and then made them feel like criminals with a fine probably cost millions of votes. Trump was promising to take that weight off their minds. Even if they bought insurance they couldn't afford the co pays so they had nothing to lose in voting for Trump.