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The GOP wants help of the Dem's

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  • Independent
    Ft.myers, FL
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    A lot of noise came from Trump and others including "slimeball' Priebus , Kasich that the Dem's should help them. If the Dem's are smart they should totally refuse such. Reasons: McConnell torpedoed everything when Obama ruled and still does. Also Trump destroyed everything what even "smelled" like Obama. let alone what the whole Trump "mafia" clan has said and done against the Dem's.

    If they beg the Dem's, then I would set the following ultimatum:

    1) Show and produce all your tax returns of the last 10 years

    2) Stop the Gorsuch appointment

    3) No more "tweeting"

    4) Fire Sessions, Nunes, Priebus, Bannon, Miller, Ivanka, Kusner, Ryan

    I guess the Dem's should learn to negotiate for a change.

  • Strongly Liberal
    Independent
    Ohio
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    The Dems can just sit back and watch the show. Why would they want to help these idiots ? They have the support of the American people to just stand clear and let the fat idiot flounder. He is a not someone you can reason with . Anything he says is a lie. Allow the Rethugs to live with what they have created. Just keep up the call for indipendendent prosecutors and tax returns. That is the song the people want to hear.

    It's will be satisfying to watch the crooks who can't shoot straight . The fat idiot is clueless. He has surrounded himself with very stupid people. When they turn one by one it's going to be delicious. They are going to be so busy testifying and having meetings to work on their crimes and cover ups the Dems will be shooting fish in a barrel.

    There will be no tax reform. The Rethugs are revolting against the fat idiot and his criminal gang who can't shoot straight. They are beginning to circle the wagons and protect their seats . They see the writing on the wall. The fat idiot is clueless . He does not understand even simple concepts. Reagon was like a child , W was also clueless. They paved the way for the fat idiot. But the neo liberal billionaires who have driven us into fascism meant to use Hillary to accomplish their goals. They own the congressmen and senators who are being attacked now by the fat idiot. So that's why the Koch's are not allowing the fat idiot to do one thing.

    I don't think Putin can help the fat idiot either.

  • Liberal Democrat
    Democrat
    Colorado Springs, CO
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    Dutch -- Your post feels more like a rant...a wish list of sorts. As a realist, I don't see making these demands will do anything to change his course. We might get lucky and stop the Gorsuch nomination temporarily if McConnell doesn't go nuclear.

    I would rather negotiate on things that can benefit Americans. Trump has talked about rebuilding infrastructure. Let's work with him on that...but do not accept private enterprise control of our infrastructure projects. I'm okay on adding user fees like tolls to pay for future bridges and roads, but not turning over the ownership of those roads/bridges to private enterprises.

  • Independent
    Ft.myers, FL
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    Schmidt Wrote:

    Dutch -- Your post feels more like a rant...a wish list of sorts. As a realist, I don't see making these demands will do anything to change his course. We might get lucky and stop the Gorsuch nomination temporarily if McConnell doesn't go nuclear.

    I would rather negotiate on things that can benefit Americans. Trump has talked about rebuilding infrastructure. Let's work with him on that...but do not accept private enterprise control of our infrastructure projects. I'm okay on adding user fees like tolls to pay for future bridges and roads, but not turning over the ownership of those roads/bridges to private enterprises.

    No Schmidt it is not an "rant" but reality, if you want to negotiate, then you start with an long wish list. You may end up then with at least something.

    Adding "toll" to pay for bridges and roads is the wrong thing; here in FL lots of toll roads, but no one "fixes" even the potholes; the "toll' money likely ends up in "No mans land". Let's cut spending on defense and spent the 54 billion present to the Pentagon on "real" infrastructure instead. See my other mail on that.

  • Strongly Liberal Democrat
    Democrat
    Portland, OR
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    The tough part about being the minority party is that Democrats aren't in a position to be making demands. Other than filibustering all non-budget related items that come up in the Senate, Democrats have very little leverage when it comes to legislation during these next two years. If we win back control of the House or Senate in 2019 then we would be playing with a stronger hand, but that's a long way off.

    We are more the opposition party than anything else right now. Sure, we can kill any non-budget related legislation that we want to, but we are hardly in a position to come to the table with a huge wish list of items and expect a fair negotiation from the Republicans in return.

    I say we need to just sit back and let the Republicans tie a noose around their own necks. Their own party can't agree on how to repeal a law they spent the past seven years railing against. Do you really think that they will be able to agree to a massive overhaul of the tax system if they couldn't do that?

  • Center Left
    Independent
    Central, FL
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    I think rants are long overdue. It's time for it to be known that we have expectations and we pay attention to politicians / politics. The Bill Maher thing about 4 weeks ago was correct. We (as a party) have become hyper sensitive about political correctness to the point where we are too often trampled upon. I would love for 100 thousand Democrats to rant or rave. To vent, unload, and let the Republican party, The Russians, the deplorable groups of armed thugs, and the others to know we are watching, waiting, and planning to un white wash 'murica. We have been patient too long.
  • Independent
    Ft.myers, FL
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    TJ Wrote: I think rants are long overdue. It's time for it to be known that we have expectations and we pay attention to politicians / politics. The Bill Maher thing about 4 weeks ago was correct. We (as a party) have become hyper sensitive about political correctness to the point where we are too often trampled upon. I would love for 100 thousand Democrats to rant or rave. To vent, unload, and let the Republican party, The Russians, the deplorable groups of armed thugs, and the others to know we are watching, waiting, and planning to un white wash 'murica. We have been patient too long.

    Jared and T'J. that is the right attitude; congratulations. Yes Bill Maher is my type of guy who says on how it is. Don't show your weak side, but fight realistically. Most of the present GOP B.S. is pure diversion tactics; but a lot of Dem's fall for it.

    Sorry to say but we should fight to impeach the whole bunch. Negotiate only if you are sure you get something in return which has real "value"; get it "black on white" if so. The GOP is fighting "back alley stuff" thus be aware of that.

  • Independent
    Washington
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    Schmidt Wrote:

    Dutch -- Your post feels more like a rant...a wish list of sorts. As a realist, I don't see making these demands will do anything to change his course. We might get lucky and stop the Gorsuch nomination temporarily if McConnell doesn't go nuclear.

    I would rather negotiate on things that can benefit Americans. Trump has talked about rebuilding infrastructure. Let's work with him on that...but do not accept private enterprise control of our infrastructure projects. I'm okay on adding user fees like tolls to pay for future bridges and roads, but not turning over the ownership of those roads/bridges to private enterprises.

    I agree with this. I get it he wants to try new ideas because he believes government can't do anything right. Well, I really think he wants the private sector to own everything. If roads were privately owned, bottled neck areas, such as bridges, would become ransom tolls because of there no other way to get from A to B within 50 miles. I'd guess Trump would love to sell all federally maintained properties to the private sector (roads, bridges, parks, etc). Its not going to happened, but he could shoot a few holes in the boat before turning things over to another president to repair\clean-up.

  • Independent
    Washington
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    My main concern about working with Trump is his negotiating tactics. As a businessman, he likes to play both sides against each other to achieve what he wants, and he is known to do bait-and-switch.

    If I were negotiating with him, he would have to commit to doing his end first, rather than his preferred method of getting others to things that benefit him the most (not what benefit voters), with the promise he' going fulfill his end of the deal at a later date. He's known for the backing of his side of the deal at the last moment with by saying "I noticed XXX isn't perfect, so the deal is off, you need to do more XXX before I do anything." People tend to do more XXX thinking after do more, he will fulfill his part of the deal, but he just strings them along, always needing more XXX. An example could strike a deal that if the democrats vote to pass his tax cuts and confirm Gorsuch, he will support a democratic healthcare bill that fixes problems with Obamacare. If the democrats agreed, he'd leave them out in the cold after they did their part of the deal. As I suggested, he comes up with an excuse for backing out, yet doing so in a manner that suggests that democrats only need to do a few more things and he'll work with democrats. Bottomline, there will always be a few more things dem need to do.

  • Liberal Democrat
    Democrat
    Colorado Springs, CO
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    wwjd -- You make a good point about Trump's negotiating tactics. He is so unpredictable mainly because he is not a student of anything. He is obsessed with his own image, and depending on how the political winds blows he is likely to shift course or abandon anyone without giving reason. Maybe Jared Kushner or Bannon or Ivanka gets in his ear at the last moment.

    Not only that you also cannot trust the Republicans to negotiate in good faith. They're torn between their constituents and their sugar daddies...and they do worry about getting primaried by Koch money. Remember the Kochtopus from a few years ago. It's still active at the local, state level and Congressional level.

    Propublica, February 14, 2014: How Dark Money Flows Through the Koch Network

    So Democrats would need to be very wary in dealing with Trump, McConnell and Ryan. I keep using the word "ruthless" to describe them, but that's the way I see them. Still if Dems can play their cards right, they might get some of what they want...but no deals that leave part of their promise for the future. Every deal has to be locked down leaving nothing to trust.

  • Independent
    Ft.myers, FL
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    Schmidt Wrote:

    wwjd -- You make a good point about Trump's negotiating tactics. He is so unpredictable mainly because he is not a student of anything. He is obsessed with his own image, and depending on how the political winds blows he is likely to shift course or abandon anyone without giving reason. Maybe Jared Kushner or Bannon or Ivanka gets in his ear at the last moment.

    Not only that you also cannot trust the Republicans to negotiate in good faith. They're torn between their constituents and their sugar daddies...and they do worry about getting primaried by Koch money. Remember the Kochtopus from a few years ago. It's still active at the local, state level and Congressional level.

    Propublica, February 14, 2014: How Dark Money Flows Through the Koch Network

    So Democrats would need to be very wary in dealing with Trump, McConnell and Ryan. I keep using the word "ruthless" to describe them, but that's the way I see them. Still if Dems can play their cards right, they might get some of what they want...but no deals that leave part of their promise for the future. Every deal has to be locked down leaving nothing to trust.

    Yes Schmidt, absolutely correct. Once you hand over the "keys" to the rich GOP mafia; then you never get an chance to get things back to normal. The voters should have thought of that at the voting booth.
  • Liberal Democrat
    Democrat
    Kenosha, WI
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    Not even. I wouldn't give him (Donald) or the R party the time of day. We democrats could now be the party of NO, just like they did with Obama. You left out turtle face (McConnell) in the firings category.

    youtube.com/watch?v=W-A09a_gHJc

  • Independent
    Ft.myers, FL
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    Dockadams Wrote:

    Not even. I wouldn't give him (Donald) or the R party the time of day. We democrats could now be the party of NO, just like they did with Obama. You left out turtle face (McConnell) in the firings category.

    youtube.com/watch?v=W-A09a_gHJc

    Yes that brainless idiot "turtle face" can't even speak normal English; it must be "muddied swamp" language; It is time he "gets" something.
  • Liberal Democrat
    Democrat
    Kenosha, WI
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    That's how Walker won in Wisconsin, and even in the recall election, Koch infiltrated Wisconsin in the gubernatorial election by bringing in people who posed as democrats, as was reported locally (Milwaukee) but were really republican operatives, and they swamped the gubernatorial and recall elections by outspending democrats at a ratio of more than 2:1

    They flooded and bombarded the airwaves, I remember that very well.

    Here's a clip from Wisconsindc.org

    Walker and Republican groups and committees outspent all of the Democratic candidates, groups and committees $58.7 million to $21.9 million in the governor’s race where Walker defeated his Democratic challenger Tom Barrett and independent candidate for governor Hariprasad Trivedi who spent $305,204 wisdc.org/pr072512.php

  • Center Left
    Independent
    Central, FL
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    I want my party to fight. Fighting effectively, with aggressive creativity would be a bonus. We have so far to go.