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Libertarian party?

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  • Independent
    Ft.myers, FL
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    Right now some news about the "libertarians" According to the polls they would get about 11%. So my ignorant vision says: Why does n't Sanders join them and runs on that ticket? So mathematically he will be "even" with Hillary, or even beat her if he adds his votes to the 11%.

    Looks to me a "win" situation, because the "libertarian" idea's are more in line with what the general public wants,

    Comments?

  • Strongly Liberal Democrat
    Democrat
    Portland, OR
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    Sanders running as a libertarian would be like Ted Cruz running as a Democrat.

    None of Bernies views, especially when it comes to taxes and the economy are libertarian.

  • Liberal Democrat
    Democrat
    Colorado Springs, CO
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    Dutch -- You must be joking. Here's some excerpts from the Libertarian Party Platform. They don't sound very "Berniesque" to me.

    2.4 Government Finance and Spending

    All persons are entitled to keep the fruits of their labor. We call for the repeal of the income tax, the abolishment of the Internal Revenue Service and all federal programs and services not required under the U.S. Constitution. We oppose any legal requirements forcing employers to serve as tax collectors. Government should not incur debt, which burdens future generations without their consent. We support the passage of a "Balanced Budget Amendment" to the U.S. Constitution, provided that the budget is balanced exclusively by cutting expenditures, and not by raising taxes.

    2.5 Money and Financial Markets

    We favor free-market banking, with unrestricted competition among banks and depository institutions of all types. Markets are not actually free unless fraud is vigorously combated and neither profits nor losses are socialized. Individuals engaged in voluntary exchange should be free to use as money any mutually agreeable commodity or item. We support a halt to inflationary monetary policies and unconstitutional legal tender laws.

    2.6 Marketplace Freedom

    Libertarians support free markets. We defend the right of individuals to form corporations, cooperatives and other types of entities based on voluntary association. We oppose all forms of government subsidies and bailouts to business, labor, or any other special interest. Government should not compete with private enterprise.

    2.7 Labor Markets

    Employment and compensation agreements between private employers and employees are outside the scope of government, and these contracts should not be encumbered by government-mandated benefits or social engineering. We support the right of private employers and employees to choose whether or not to bargain with each other through a labor union. Bargaining should be free of government interference, such as compulsory arbitration or imposing an obligation to bargain.

    2.8 Education

    Education is best provided by the free market, achieving greater quality, accountability and efficiency with more diversity of choice. Recognizing that the education of children is a parental responsibility, we would restore authority to parents to determine the education of their children, without interference from government. Parents should have control of and responsibility for all funds expended for their children's education.

    2.9 Health Care

    We favor a free market health care system. We recognize the freedom of individuals to determine the level of health insurance they want (if any), the level of health care they want, the care providers they want, the medicines and treatments they will use and all other aspects of their medical care, including end-of-life decisions. People should be free to purchase health insurance across state lines.

    2.10 Retirement and Income Security

    Retirement planning is the responsibility of the individual, not the government. Libertarians would phase out the current government-sponsored Social Security system and transition to a private voluntary system. The proper and most effective source of help for the poor is the voluntary efforts of private groups and individuals. We believe members of society will become more charitable and civil society will be strengthened as government reduces its activity in this realm.

  • Independent
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    Libertarian party is the party of the spoiled 4 year old.

    the nonsense about programs not required by the construction is an excellent example. Hey, half-wits! The constitution gives congress the power to pass laws which includes creating programs. Now certainly arguments can be made as to whether a program is for "the general welfare" but the constitution only forbids a very few things and the power of congress to pass laws is specifically stated especially as regards the general welfare.

    libertarian? No, thanks. Not until they grow up.

  • Independent
    Ft.myers, FL
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    Everyone thanks for your replies; anyway if I read those, then I get the impression that again as in the past a third party will never work in this country. Thus simply said we are stuck with two candidates who are both a disaster. The only one who will benefit from it is Trump. Once Bernie steps out then forget Hillary. Trump will fight till the bitter end and will use every trick he can get.
  • Liberal Democrat
    Democrat
    Colorado Springs, CO
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    Dutch --- Again we disagree. Hillary Clinton will not be a disaster as president. She is well qualified. I know she doesn't pass the purity test of some ideologues, but if you had done the research on her that I have done, you would not have any anxiety about her. She does her homework and all her proposals are well thought out. She is more qualified than Obama was when he took the presidency. Only time will tell if she will be a great president.

    People say FDR was a great president. It is easy to be great if you have a Congress that fully backs you and doesn't try to sabotage your presidency as the Republicans have done to President Obama.

  • Liberal
    Independent
    Durham, NH
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    No doubt about it - the Libertarians are the worst of the worst. They are nothing more than a bunch of self-centered, selfish and hate filled isolationists who are incapable of getting along with anyone. They actually make the Republicans look good and that's not easy ;)!
  • Strongly Liberal Democrat
    Democrat
    Pensacola, FL
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    Missing the point. Dutch is not suggesting Bernie become a libertarian. He is proposing using the libertarian position being on the ticket as a vehicle to the Presidency.
  • Independent
    Ft.myers, FL
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    pr Wrote: No doubt about it - the Libertarians are the worst of the worst. They are nothing more than a bunch of self-centered, selfish and hate filled isolationists who are incapable of getting along with anyone. They actually make the Republicans look good and that's not easy ;)!
    P.R. sure I'm not a fan either, but looking at the "game", it would be good if someone would throw a wrench into the whole election; I don't care how, but hope the result is that neither Hillary or Trump gets elected.
  • Strongly Liberal Democrat
    Democrat
    Portland, OR
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    Chet Ruminski Wrote: Missing the point. Dutch is not suggesting Bernie become a libertarian. He is proposing using the libertarian position being on the ticket as a vehicle to the Presidency.
    But libertarian positions are the exact antithesis of every single thing you stand for. Don't you find that a bit ironic??
  • Strongly Liberal Democrat
    Democrat
    Portland, OR
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    Dutch Wrote: P.R. sure I'm not a fan either, but looking at the "game", it would be good if someone would throw a wrench into the whole election; I don't care how, but hope the result is that neither Hillary or Trump gets elected.

    That result would then be the Republican/Tea Party dominated House of Representatives would get to choose who the next President is. Would you rather have the Tea Party pick our next President over a Hillary Presidency?

    There are three scenarios for November:

    1) Hillary is elected. (Sorry Bernie supporters, but it is almost statistically impossible for him to be the nominee and you are fooling yourselves if you think otherwise.)

    2) Trump is elected.

    3) No one gets to 270 electoral college votes and the House of Representatives chooses the next President. There is a zero chance that the Libertarian ticket wins enough states to get to 270.

    So those are our options. I hope you Bernie or Bust supporters understand these three options very well. There isn't going to be some "Knight in Shining Armor" sweeping in to save the day. That's not how elections work in modern day America.

  • Independent
    Ft.myers, FL
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    jaredsxtn Wrote:
    Dutch Wrote: P.R. sure I'm not a fan either, but looking at the "game", it would be good if someone would throw a wrench into the whole election; I don't care how, but hope the result is that neither Hillary or Trump gets elected.

    That result would then be the Republican/Tea Party dominated House of Representatives would get to choose who the next President is. Would you rather have the Tea Party pick our next President over a Hillary Presidency?

    There are three scenarios for November:

    1) Hillary is elected. (Sorry Bernie supporters, but it is almost statistically impossible for him to be the nominee and you are fooling yourselves if you think otherwise.)

    2) Trump is elected.

    3) No one gets to 270 electoral college votes and the House of Representatives chooses the next President. There is a zero chance that the Libertarian ticket wins enough states to get to 270.

    So those are our options. I hope you Bernie or Bust supporters understand these three options very well. There isn't going to be some "Knight in Shining Armor" sweeping in to save the day. That's not how elections work in modern day America.

    Jared, thus it is clear that you just close your eyes and select an woman in "shining armor" as a "shoe" in because she's a woman and married to"Bill" which boils down, as the same with Trump; "spoon fed". Read my other piece about my thoughts about Hillary's "qualifications" due to "connections" thus not due to starting from the bottom up etc.
  • Strongly Liberal Democrat
    Democrat
    Portland, OR
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    Dutch Wrote: Jared, thus it is clear that you just close your eyes and select an woman in "shining armor" as a "shoe" in because she's a woman and married to"Bill" which boils down, as the same with Trump; "spoon fed".

    No, it's clear that I understand how our Constitution and party primaries work.

    Let me explain this to anyone who does not understand how we actually nominate and elect a President in this country...

    1. Each party selects a candidate. Each party is allowed to set their own rules as to how that candidate is selected.

    2. Voters head to the polls in November and choose a candidate...technically. In fact they are telling the people that represent their states electoral college delegation who to cast their electoral college vote for.

    3. Once all votes are in, the first candidate to 270 electoral college votes wins. If no one reaches that 270 or there is a tie then the election goes to the House of Representatives for them to choose who the President will be and the Senate will choose who the Vice-President will be.

    Those are just the facts and how our Constitution is written. So if the Libertarian or Independent Parties are able to siphon off enough votes from both Trump and Clinton then the winner will undoubtedly be the Republican/Tea Party dominated House of Representatives. I encourage any and everyone to read up on the Twelfth Amendment before November if they honestly think a third party is going to come in and save the day.


    I'm not closing my eyes and selecting a woman in shining armor; I'm reminding people that it is basically statistically impossible for Bernie Sanders to win enough PLEDGED delegates remaining to become the Democratic nominee. So he is now resorting to trying to convince the Super Delegates--you know, the people he has been railing against this entire campaign--to switch their votes and come to his side even though the majority of Democrats clearly favor Secretary Clinton.

    Dutch Wrote: Read my other piece about my thoughts about Hillary's "qualifications" due to "connections" thus not due to starting from the bottom up etc.

    She was duly elected Senator of New York twice and served four years as our nations top diplomat. She also happened to be widely respected and loved by both parties during her time as Secretary of State.