johnnycee Wrote: We were discussing this agreement with deceit in our hearts and hoping that the Iranians would not notice it, Whether or not Congress is supposed to sanction this or not,it still does not mean that we enter into talks with deceit in mind from the start. I am certain Iran would not be in discussion with us if they had known that the agreement would only exist for less then 2 years, then all bets are off. Some call these Congressmen who signed this letter as traitors and liken their acts as treason,when in fact they were only shedding light on a possible untruth in these discussions that would affect the security of this Nation, along with other Nations, when the facts came out that we were not acting in good faith.
johnnycee Wrote: Again I must stress the fact that the Administration headed into these talks with a express purpose to deceive, regardless of who blew the whistle,these Senators cannot be described as rogue when they expose a fallacy in the manner in which these talks are being conducted by the Executive Branch, and I say again , what would Iran do or not do when they realized that truth. You cannot believe that the "Rules" would condone deceit , the very nature of these talks steeped in deceit would not be allowed and according to your logic as long as the deceit was not uncovered it's okay
pgr Wrote: But JC knows for sure that the freshman Bagger Senator is an honest, truthfull, patriotic 'merician because he authored this "memo" to the leaders in Iran, for the sole purpose of informing them how the USA cannot be trusted. Too bad they are actually a lot more informed and educated on our constitution than most of the members of Corgress are!
jaredsxtn Wrote:pgr Wrote: But JC knows for sure that the freshman Bagger Senator is an honest, truthfull, patriotic 'merician because he authored this "memo" to the leaders in Iran, for the sole purpose of informing them how the USA cannot be trusted. Too bad they are actually a lot more informed and educated on our constitution than most of the members of Corgress are!Don't forget how God fearing the esteemed junior Senator from Arkansas is. We all know how Jesus instructed his followers to be bullies and tell the entire world how to do everything. And if they don't then Jesus instructed his followers to wage endless wars on a credit card and bankrupt the nation while ignoring the millions of poor people living on the streets throughout the country.
johnnycee Wrote: Your comments are meaningless to the real question of whether or not we are bargaining in good faith, and whether or not the Congress ever voided any international treaty is again meaningless because that is not the question,
johnnycee Wrote:so stop dancing as if you are part of the RiverDance troupe and decide whether or not that the deceit employed by this Administration has caused some serious harm to not only this discussion but future discussions with other Middle East Countries as well.
johnnycee Wrote: I am not bashing anyone let alone the President, I merely asked a question regarding the possible deceitful manner that those who are entrusted with bargaining in good faith have not done so, and apparently you can't or won't answer the question either, why. As I stated previously stated I was on a contract negotiating team and when the other party was caught in an untruth or worse, not bargaining in good faith, it usually caused us to walk away from the table until trust could be restored,or the lie acknowledged. Now this was only labor negotiations and not something as serious as nuclear weapons with possible grim possibilities for all,so to me trust and honesty would be paramount, regardless of party affiliations. Can you agree with that?
L.A. Citizen Wrote: Help me out here......The Holocaust is middle eastern history. Why am I always bombarded with all this "never forget" nonsense? Many cultures have been "cleansed"If you walk down Ventura Blvd in Encino .....you see arabs and Jews living completely harmoniously with one another.....smoking cigars and having cofee with each other outside of their store fronts. Theres also a statue of Itzak Rabin in the courtyard.....Why?I don't see a statue of "Sitting Bull"Who gives a shit about "what" Israel wants.....has nothing to do with the US Citizen. Israel takes a welfare check from this country just like everyone else.....So shut up and cash that check
Schmidt Wrote: Let me add a 2007 article by John Basil Utley that should be enlightening:AlterNet: America's Armageddonites Push for More WarI really encourage people to read this article. It was written in 2007 and holds even more true today.