Forum Thread

What Happened to AirAsia Flight 8501?

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    Dutch Wrote:
    Schmidt Wrote: Okay there are conflicting reports on the location of the crash site. One report said 6 miles from last known location. Another 10 miles. Water depth is 30 to 40 meters, which should facilitate recovery of black box.
    Schmidt, again I like to point out that not one piece of Flt 17 ever has been found; this crash should open some eyes, that likely that plane never crashed where they have been searching.
    As I said a long time ago, flight 17 was hijacked. It's sitting under tarps today. Awaiting a future terroristic flight into Tel Aviv.
    They said on CNN a few hours ago that Asia Air was in bad shape about 10 years ago and was sold for 25 cents. A freaking quarter ??????
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    Tony Johnson Wrote:
    Dutch Wrote:
    Schmidt Wrote: Okay there are conflicting reports on the location of the crash site. One report said 6 miles from last known location. Another 10 miles. Water depth is 30 to 40 meters, which should facilitate recovery of black box.
    Schmidt, again I like to point out that not one piece of Flt 17 ever has been found; this crash should open some eyes, that likely that plane never crashed where they have been searching.
    As I said a long time ago, flight 17 was hijacked. It's sitting under tarps today. Awaiting a future terroristic flight into Tel Aviv.
    They said on CNN a few hours ago that Asia Air was in bad shape about 10 years ago and was sold for 25 cents. A freaking quarter ??????
    Yup, not even a Pez dispesener was.......weird.
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    [url=https://www.democratichub.com/user/79340.aspx"> L.A. Citizen[/url] Wrote:
    pgr Wrote: Once again, the answer is obvious - Aliens or maybe God is responsible!
    Cant be Aliens....Mexico is quite a distance from Indonesia.


    Good one LA ;)
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    pgr Wrote:
    [url=https://www.democratichub.com/user/79340.aspx"> L.A. Citizen[/url] Wrote:
    pgr Wrote: Once again, the answer is obvious - Aliens or maybe God is responsible!
    Cant be Aliens....Mexico is quite a distance from Indonesia.


    Good one LA ;)
    Simple... if it were Mexicans they'd find the plane sitting on four milk crates and missing the rims and stereo
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    Dutch -- I think you mean MH 370. MH 17 was the one shot down over the Ukraine.

    However, it took Indonesian searchers 3 days to locate the debris field of AirAsia 8501. And they knew approximately where it went down. With MH 370 you have some 23,000 sq miles of the Indian Ocean with water depths up to 4 miles. It takes search vessels up to 6 days just to get to the search area. Very remote.

    MH370 search resumes in depths of Indian Ocean
  • Are you sure you want to delete this post?
        
    Tony Johnson Wrote:
    Dutch Wrote:
    Schmidt Wrote: Okay there are conflicting reports on the location of the crash site. One report said 6 miles from last known location. Another 10 miles. Water depth is 30 to 40 meters, which should facilitate recovery of black box.
    Schmidt, again I like to point out that not one piece of Flt 17 ever has been found; this crash should open some eyes, that likely that plane never crashed where they have been searching.
    As I said a long time ago, flight 17 was hijacked. It's sitting under tarps today. Awaiting a future terroristic flight into Tel Aviv.
    They said on CNN a few hours ago that Asia Air was in bad shape about 10 years ago and was sold for 25 cents. A freaking quarter ??????
    Tony, sorry I got it wrong ( so many confusing planes gone down)
  • Are you sure you want to delete this post?
        
    Schmidt Wrote: Dutch -- I think you mean MH 370. MH 17 was the one shot down over the Ukraine.

    However, it took Indonesian searchers 3 days to locate the debris field of AirAsia 8501. And they knew approximately where it went down. With MH 370 you have some 23,000 sq miles of the Indian Ocean with water depths up to 4 miles. It takes search vessels up to 6 days just to get to the search area. Very remote.

    MH370 search resumes in depths of Indian Ocean
    Yes of course you are correct, my mistake. Sure where they are searching it is so as you said, however I've still got a strong feeling it is not there; they should have found floating debris; nothing has shown up until now; nothing on beaches anywhere; there is always debris even a plastic bottle can float 10 years. But the future will tell. ( just to make sure I'm talking about MH370.)
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    L.A. Citizen Wrote:
    pgr Wrote:
    [url=https://www.democratichub.com/user/79340.aspx"> L.A. Citizen[/url] Wrote:
    pgr Wrote: Once again, the answer is obvious - Aliens or maybe God is responsible!
    Cant be Aliens....Mexico is quite a distance from Indonesia.


    Good one LA ;)
    Simple... if it were Mexicans they'd find the plane sitting on four milk crates and missing the rims and stereo
    Doubt it; the milk/orange crates would be stolen too and only the burrito wrappers would be left and the fuselage would be a rental or a grow house.
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    Getting back to the Indonesian crash site, it is now described as 100 km or about 66 miles from the planes last known location, but that location is in the opposite direction of the flight path.

    "The Indonesian authorities said the pieces of wreckage were found about 60 miles southeast of the last known position of the plane — the opposite direction from the plane’s path."

    "Luca Centurioni, a researcher at the Scripps Institution of Oceanography in San Diego who measures currents around the world, said it would not be surprising for the floating debris to have drifted 60 miles since Sunday morning, especially in unsettled weather. “The currents are not terribly strong,” he said in a telephone interview, “but the waves can be big, and the wind can push objects quite a bit.”"


    So it appears the plane probably went nearly straight down, and the winds and currents pushed the debris backwards along the flight path to the southeast. See maps.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/31/world/asia/airasia-8501-jet-missing-indonesia.html

    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-30641554
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    Schmidt Wrote: Getting back to the Indonesian crash site, it is now described as 100 km or about 66 miles from the planes last known location, but that location is in the opposite direction of the flight path.

    "The Indonesian authorities said the pieces of wreckage were found about 60 miles southeast of the last known position of the plane — the opposite direction from the plane’s path."

    "Luca Centurioni, a researcher at the Scripps Institution of Oceanography in San Diego who measures currents around the world, said it would not be surprising for the floating debris to have drifted 60 miles since Sunday morning, especially in unsettled weather. “The currents are not terribly strong,” he said in a telephone interview, “but the waves can be big, and the wind can push objects quite a bit.”"


    So it appears the plane probably went nearly straight down, and the winds and currents pushed the debris backwards along the flight path to the southeast. See maps.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/31/world/asia/airasia-8501-jet-missing-indonesia.html

    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-30641554
    Yes Schmidt, I was talking about Flt MH370 about its never found debris; not even an plastic sealed bottle!! That makes me wonder. HAPPY NEW YEAR!!!
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    Nobody will know until the analysis of the recordings on the black boxes are made. One thing is clear though that this aircraft was flying in bad weather or a storm where ground control refused to allow the flights course to deviate from it's planned flight. Several things can go wrong with a plane in flight through a storm from air turbulence, hail, dropping air pressure, and "lightning".

    A couple or so decades ago, I took a course to accumulate my CEU's for my engineering profession at a "Grounding, Binding and Lightning Protection" seminar. It was held at a laboratory in Pittsburg, where a local Professor engaged in a side business of testing airframe material for lightning dispersion. You highly want any lightning that hits the aircraft to disperse and not concentrate to a point. If the aircraft material allows the energy from lightning to concentrate into a point, you burn through the material. Burning through the material will contribute to fuselage explosion where fuel is stored, severe damage to hydraulics for aircraft control and loss of electrical systems. The professor had a lucrative business, such as, with Boeing, McDonald-Douglass, Lockheed, and many international aircraft industries. The primary concept to dispersion of energy is allowing the charge to dissipate and not cause heat related damage.

    I'm sure the back boxes will speak on any possible lightning damage. Aircraft get hits by lightning all the time and in most situations continue to fly very well. Some of the most spectacular pictures people have an opportunity to take a snapshot of is an aircraft going through a storm and getting hit by lightning. Aircraft use several methods to thwart lightning even using rods sticking out on the air frame. Many of those appendages are also sensors, but they can act as a lightning rod the same. However, there remains today continued testing of aircraft material to the ability of withstanding lightning hits. The laboratory provided all of us the enjoyment of watching lightning being made. The contraption looks like something out of Frankenstein's movie. The generators sounded off and when a measured potential point was made, a switch was thrown and "CRACK" the lighting came through several feet into a test material. Looking at the material I remembered was remarkably unharmed with only a slight white dust where the charge hit.
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    AMC -- Good discussion. Modern airlines are designed to shed lightning charges. Probably a greater risk is hail damage.

    Washington Post, August 27, 2014: Why is an airplane safe from lightning strikes?

    "The Federal Aviation Administration estimates that on average, lightning hits each airliner in U.S. service once a year.

    "Yet the last U.S. airliner crash that lighting caused occurred on December 8, 1963 when lightning struck a Pan American Boeing 707 over Elkton, Md. Investigators said it ignited jet fuel vapor in a wing tank, which exploded, causing the jet to crash, killing all 73 aboard."
  • Are you sure you want to delete this post?
        
    Schmidt Wrote: AMC -- Good discussion. Modern airlines are designed to shed lightning charges. Probably a greater risk is hail damage.

    Washington Post, August 27, 2014: Why is an airplane safe from lightning strikes?

    "The Federal Aviation Administration estimates that on average, lightning hits each airliner in U.S. service once a year.

    "Yet the last U.S. airliner crash that lighting caused occurred on December 8, 1963 when lightning struck a Pan American Boeing 707 over Elkton, Md. Investigators said it ignited jet fuel vapor in a wing tank, which exploded, causing the jet to crash, killing all 73 aboard."
    Passenger jets have a much more limited flight envelope; versus fighter jets. It certainly can not fly inverted or have negative wing forces; the Airbus has very good computer control in order to correct if there is a chance of getting outside the flight envelope. however again it is dependant of pilot action in certain situations like excessive windshear such as in a thundercloud. Due the fact this A320 was likely a stretched one ( A321) because of the headcount; then the flight envelope is even more limited, because the stresses are much higher. So my point is, the plane probably went outside the flight envelope and broke up.
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    Dutch -- Yes that seems to be at least one expert's opinion:

    Independent: AirAsia flight QZ8501: Radar data shows 'unbelievably steep climb' before crash that pushed plane beyond its limits

    "Radar data being examined by investigators appeared to show that AirAsia Flight QZ8501 made an “unbelievably” steep climb before it crashed, possibly pushing it beyond the Airbus A320's limits.

    "The data was transmitted before the aircraft disappeared from the screens of air traffic controllers in Jakarta on Sunday, said a source familiar with the probe's initial findings.

    “So far, the numbers taken by the radar are unbelievably high. This rate of climb is very high, too high. It appears to be beyond the performance envelope of the aircraft,” he said."

    You can read more at the above link.