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cops and recorders (photo) . . . . . but first little pricks fell big predators

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  • Independent
    Massachusetts
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    MET OR METS matters.
    I was going to make this a reply to Jared's thread regarding police cameras.
    But cop-cam controversy will be the second part of what I'm going to say in this first of perhaps two posts of this week (a day late for last week).

    First. IN THE JUNGLE, THE MIGHTY JUNGLE,. . . THE CHARGING ASSAILANT IS ONE HELL OF A LOT MORE BIG AND DANGEROUS . . . . AND OF A VASTLY DIFFERENT SOCIOECONOMIC AND ETHNIC AND RACIAL AND POLITICAL AND RELIGIOUS .. . . EXPERIENCE AND ORIENTATION AND MINDSET . . . . THAN THOSE BEING ATTACKED. (the officials) . . . .
    And what is the reaction of the "officials"?
    As the enraged, essentially psychopathological creature, totally/terroristically/territorystically intending their murder . . . as it nears . . . .
    One of the biologists raises and fires and and the little tranquilizer dart goes plurp into the purp . . . which promplty falls to the ground. When the dna and stool and other samples have been taken, and other official matters completed, the rhino or hippo staggers to its feet and toddles off. Does this not reveal the means to preempt and prevent death by "deadly concerns of circumstances" -- a cop's assessment of his own possible death if he doesn't shoot first?
    I picture myself wearing a uniform, alone at the door of a car I've stopped in the night, and I can feel the fear/hate of the four big African men in it and it sure looks like there's something metallic beside the driver and the guy's hand next to him sure looks like it's reaching toward . . . . . .
    Would a rational reaction of restraint on my part be to query, "Pardon, sir, but would you please tell me what it is you seem to be intent on taking in hand lest I assume personal vulnerability and perhaps over-react to secure my own sense of safety??"
    Could it be that unless you or I or any of us were where cops so often are, we'd really have no "informed, experiential" justification in screaming "police brutality" overall? Though undeniably there are brutal cops and just plain carnage committed. Yes, some cops are deadly animals. It's residual in some humans' nature.
    Some of nature's humans.
    BUT LEST I TAKE THIS TO TYPICAL (for me) EXTREME LENGTH. . . . . MY POINT (and for this new thread rather than reply) IS . . . .
    THERE SHOULD BE HUMAN-DOSAGE-CALIBRATED TRANQUILIZER DARTS DEVELOPED.
    THERE SHOULD BE TRANQUILIZER GUNS STANDARD-ISSUED TO LAW ENFORCEMENT PERSONNEL INCLUDING EVEN SECURITY GUARDS.
    (would have made a difference in that unfortunate Zimmerman v. Martin misunderstanding).
    THERE SHOULD BE THAT PROTECTION FOR THOSE WHO PROTECT US -- TO SHOOT FIRST AND SORT OUT THE SHIT (and dna etc.) LATER WHEN THE THREAT HAS BEEN SECURED (cuffed, or whatever).
    SHOOT FIRST. IF IT WORKS WITH MASSIVE WILD ANIMALS IT SHOULD WORK WITH EVEN VERY LARGE FELLOW HUMANS.
    SHOOT FIRST. NO HARM DONE.
    But prior to issueing the devices and instituting the preemptive projectile procedure, LEGISLATE FIRST. IN ORDER TO PREVENT WHAT WOULD NO DOUBT OTHERWISE BE THE ATTACK OF THE LAWSUITS, THE LAWYERS. Against which the cops would have no protection.
    Long ago I made this tranquilizer suggestion I THINK IT SHOULD BE AN IDEA DISCUSSED, PASSED ON, PROLIFERATED, INCORPORATED.

    Now for part II.
    As for cop-cams, no, not demeaning to officers even though I'm sure someone other than I would be calling them Keystone cops.
    What's the reason for the resistance? Encumbrance or interference with movement or comfort? Those in uniform in the full-war fury and furnace of the Middle East manage in cases when they're almost outfitted like "transformers".
    As Jared points out, the domestic police are being provided and welcoming (even tanks!!) heavy weaponry "past expiration date" for military usage.
    Such will provide protection, deterrence. The proportion of device to demographic (other than a Watts-size venue) is a bit much -- but if rocket launchers and a fighter plane for this or that borough were offered, the materiel would sure be welcomed even by whoever is the sherriff of Maybury now. (or was it Mayberry?)
    So why not simple cameras to document what happens in confrontations??
    Yet there may be valid reasons for the police resistance.
    If so, they should be made known, passed on, proliferated, and incorporated into the necessary media examination and even expose' of such an important issue. For out of control (or context) incidents are resulting in out-of-control nationwide reactions including almost an exponential detrimental of the folk most victimized making their whole communities the victims of their outrage (and looting and burning and other "protests"). Gotta be stopped.
    Non-lethal "shoot-to-still" preemption might work. CAMERAS ON COPS MIGHT WORK.
    Have I read recently that cameras are being (or have been) installed which record surgeries . . . . . .
    Wonder what the reaction of a cop whose kid's going to have a life[-threatening operation would be if "surgeons against surveillance cameras" organized?
  • Liberal
    Other Party
    Llos Angeles, CA
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    Darts? Funny, Europe seems to police just fine using Billy clubs as the primary weapon. Also, someone would die as result from being allergic to the chemical used in them.
    Is this the best coming from this "wonderful" melting pot so many describe? This exceptional countrty?You suggest turning our streets into an African reserve?

    If so, the game here in this country pay for the darts
  • Independent
    Foxborough, MA
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    L.A. Citizen Wrote: Darts? Funny,

    Not so funny really. It's the concept. Animal control officers in our cities use dart tranquilizers to protect themselves and others from wild or diseased animals. The animal is then subdued and they can proceed to the next best steps. We have tasers and stun guns. Non-lethal / self-defense / but effective. Why NOT tranquilizer darts? Is this not a better option than needless killing? You can sort it out once the heat of the moment passes. If there is a chemical which perhaps affects one in many, is that still not better than killing many? Once dead, there is no way to say "oops, wrong guy, wrong interpretation, wrong whatever"......if simply subdued, then the right assessment can be made and proper action taken.
    Violence in this country is escalating rapidly. Law enforcement is an issue. What we should be doing is finding better ways for these "public protectors" to do the job they are trained to do, without having to resort to the violence they are trained to police. Anything and everything available should be considered to make our streets safer.
  • Liberal
    Other Party
    Llos Angeles, CA
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    No, it's funny. This is the best you can come up with? DARTS. While other civilized nations carry guns and don't seem to have this problem you suggest another projectile. We pay the cops.....do you understand that? they work for us? they just have to do their jobs......you see, they want to do their jobs tooo much, Over zealous and aggressuive is a personal trait.....not fit for the job
  • Independent
    Foxborough, MA
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    Never said cops should not carry guns.
    They should not be so quick to use them.
    If there are less deadly alternatives when the threat is not clear, then let those be the first line of defense.
    Once you're dead, you're dead. When you're stunned or "darted" - there's time for more investigation of what really happened.
  • Liberal
    Other Party
    Llos Angeles, CA
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    I disagree. They should have guns....but damn, they're using them way tooo quickly. It's not hard weeding out "bad apples" from the beginning if you really want to. The entire police forces are providing the culture of "attack mode" The whole pot needs to be stirred. Guys got too comfortable in their ways. It's time to put a stop to it and hold people ACCOUNTABLE for their actions.

    If you want to go out and be Robo-cop...that's fine, but know theres consequences....when they start losing jobs---all the way up to going to prison.....you'd be amazed how quickly change will come.

    The football player who wore the shirt this sunday...the police wanted an apology.....are you serious? the police work for the public, the public should never apologize when feeding your families (very well). Nobody got that. The police are our servants.....you don't apologize to the help. The police should be "YES SIR MR. PUBLIC" we'll do whatever you ask
  • Independent
    Foxborough, MA
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    L.A. Citizen Wrote: I disagree. They should have guns....but damn, they're using them way tooo quickly.

    If you are responding to my (above) - please re-read. My first 2 sentences are the same as yours..
    they SHOULD carry guns, but they ARE using them too quickly.....
    so where do you disagree with my comment?
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    The suggested "body cams" for the police -- sound like an ideal answer, since the police will have to react more "positively" to any situation. BUT, they really must be an expensive alternative, costing "thousands?" of dollars? And to be honest, -- I think the "body cams" can very easily be "disabled". You might think about THIS scenario: Police may be getting extra upset, during an encounter with black vs white. Things escalate, little by little, until it appears that the police want to take action. But they don't want any "lawsuits" to appear, long after the event has concluded.

    So, at some point, the blacks are told to "disengage" their actions, in order to preserve the peace. Nevertheless, the blacks keep on getting semi-violent & even worse. So the police begin to "get ready" for any violent incident that may occur. They want "no visible evidence" of their next few actions. So they spit out their bubblegum out of their mouths, & take the sticky stuff & roll it into a ball, and then deftly stick that ball to the "lens" of the body cam. Voila!! No image on camera - so no evidence or proof of police wrong-doing. -- (Million$ of Tax $ wasted, since evidence was concealed & covered up - by a 50 cent bubblegum).
  • Independent
    Ft.myers, FL
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    I guess none of you got it right! It is the "training" which is done wrong; In Europe it is "police" training, not semi-military training like here. Also ex-military are not suited for such job, which requires more phycological training than playing the "bully"; So as also Obama admits the training should be totally revamped. I guess as usual in this country it will done half ass, because they refuse to look at training programs of other countries ( chauvinism) so the "military Rambo" part will likely not be dropped. Result "zero"
  • Liberal
    Other Party
    Llos Angeles, CA
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    Dutch Wrote: I guess none of you got it right! It is the "training" which is done wrong; In Europe it is "police" training, not semi-military training like here. Also ex-military are not suited for such job, which requires more phycological training than playing the "bully"; So as also Obama admits the training should be totally revamped. I guess as usual in this country it will done half ass, because they refuse to look at training programs of other countries ( chauvinism) so the "military Rambo" part will likely not be dropped. Result "zero"
    Dutch, it isn't the training. They don't teach brutality at the LAPD acadamy.They come like this to the academy, and then a brotherhood is formed as they've morphed into gangs. The LAPD embraces that same street code.....and then you add all those pre-conceived beliefs that these ill prepared, non-educated young men bring to the pot.....now you have a huge soupy mess. A culture of racist, agressive, un-educated robo-cops.

    It's the lack of training. People are who they are.......stressful situatiuons don't mold people....they reveal people for who they really are. Emotions