Forum Thread

tracking and surveillance of people and planes

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  • Independent
    Massachusetts
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    The IRS should be the agency responsible for all air traffic.
    In this era of tehnological capability for "omni-auditing-of-existence" (so to speak), that
    especially a commercial jet can "disappear" is tragically ludicrous. What with satellites above,
    anything below should be discernable, traceable, trackable -- anywhere unless submerged
    or subterranean, it would seem.
    When "systems-gaps" can represent Bermuda Triangles (again, so to speak) the systems
    need to be upgraded.
    If it were an overdue taxpayer, the IRS would find that plane!!!
    Bad enough the "disappearance" from air-control tracking of a transcontinental flight. More
    serious was the situation on 9/11. First, that in the airspace over a major city the plane (or
    planes) disappeared from radar even momentarily -- and that control of, resulting in crashing
    into buildings of, the craft could be taken over by anyone without some system of remote
    over-ride of "aircraft-autonomy" by ground-based air traffic controllers/systems.

    The singular person (well, there were two), insufficiency of "tracking"? -- a recent fire in
    a Back Bay townhouse in Boston took the lives of two firefighters. From what I've heard and
    read, the tragedy wasn't a case of some sudden collapse upon them. Rather, though not
    the cause of their deaths per se, that their specific location in the building was unknown had
    something to do with their not getting out.
    A number of years ago in Worcester, Mass, a worse entrapment and death of six firemen
    took place in the inferno of an old cold-storage building with labyrinthine freezer-rooms. In
    the darkness dimmed by the smoke, they apparently could not find their way out. Nor could
    those trying to get to them find them.

    With the available technology, it would seem that some transponder or "chip" should be
    attached to (or even implanted in) firefighters (and miners and others at risk of entrapment
    or interference of any kind with escape). In firefighting situations, someone in a special
    vehicle close-by would be monitoring a computer screen on which each individual within the
    building would appear like a "radar blip".
    Developing and programming such a system would interface building department plans and
    records and perhaps even an ongoing assay of interiors -- so that room layouts at address
    locations could be "matrices" or "screen formats" within which the "blips" were operating (firemen
    fighting the fire or searching to rescue).

    Lojack installed, your car can be traced and recovered. Cell phone stolen or lost and if it's a
    "smart" one it can be located with specificity. Chip-in-pet provides that if it wanders or even is
    kidnapped, its location is likely discernable to some surveillance system.
    That a commercial jet's immensity can "disappear" is seems almost counter-intuitive,
    The location of personnel so proximate as in a burning building being unknown, untracked,
    seems almost culpability in view of capability.

    But in either perspective, either proportion, of the above, there should be no blame for what
    has not been implemented. These are not cases analogous to mine-disasters resulting from
    any officialdom (or corporate) callousness or malfeasance or failure to implement required safety
    measures.
    The issue of concern here is that the safety and surveillance tech, so pervasive in other
    parameters, should be implemented in the domains I've considered.
  • Independent
    Ft.myers, FL
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    alongcameaschneider Wrote: The IRS should be the agency responsible for all air traffic.
    In this era of tehnological capability for "omni-auditing-of-existence" (so to speak), that
    especially a commercial jet can "disappear" is tragically ludicrous. What with satellites above,
    anything below should be discernable, traceable, trackable -- anywhere unless submerged
    or subterranean, it would seem.
    When "systems-gaps" can represent Bermuda Triangles (again, so to speak) the systems
    need to be upgraded.
    If it were an overdue taxpayer, the IRS would find that plane!!!
    Bad enough the "disappearance" from air-control tracking of a transcontinental flight. More
    serious was the situation on 9/11. First, that in the airspace over a major city the plane (or
    planes) disappeared from radar even momentarily -- and that control of, resulting in crashing
    into buildings of, the craft could be taken over by anyone without some system of remote
    over-ride of "aircraft-autonomy" by ground-based air traffic controllers/systems.

    The singular person (well, there were two), insufficiency of "tracking"? -- a recent fire in
    a Back Bay townhouse in Boston took the lives of two firefighters. From what I've heard and
    read, the tragedy wasn't a case of some sudden collapse upon them. Rather, though not
    the cause of their deaths per se, that their specific location in the building was unknown had
    something to do with their not getting out.
    A number of years ago in Worcester, Mass, a worse entrapment and death of six firemen
    took place in the inferno of an old cold-storage building with labyrinthine freezer-rooms. In
    the darkness dimmed by the smoke, they apparently could not find their way out. Nor could
    those trying to get to them find them.

    With the available technology, it would seem that some transponder or "chip" should be
    attached to (or even implanted in) firefighters (and miners and others at risk of entrapment
    or interference of any kind with escape). In firefighting situations, someone in a special
    vehicle close-by would be monitoring a computer screen on which each individual within the
    building would appear like a "radar blip".
    Developing and programming such a system would interface building department plans and
    records and perhaps even an ongoing assay of interiors -- so that room layouts at address
    locations could be "matrices" or "screen formats" within which the "blips" were operating (firemen
    fighting the fire or searching to rescue).

    Lojack installed, your car can be traced and recovered. Cell phone stolen or lost and if it's a
    "smart" one it can be located with specificity. Chip-in-pet provides that if it wanders or even is
    kidnapped, its location is likely discernable to some surveillance system.
    That a commercial jet's immensity can "disappear" is seems almost counter-intuitive,
    The location of personnel so proximate as in a burning building being unknown, untracked,
    seems almost culpability in view of capability.

    But in either perspective, either proportion, of the above, there should be no blame for what
    has not been implemented. These are not cases analogous to mine-disasters resulting from
    any officialdom (or corporate) callousness or malfeasance or failure to implement required safety
    measures.
    The issue of concern here is that the safety and surveillance tech, so pervasive in other
    parameters, should be implemented in the domains I've considered.
    Sure good story; however this is a cruel world, tracking has its complications. A friend of my wife had her I-Pad stolen; finally it got tracked on its tracking code; however the police in Miami was overloaded and did not find it valuable enough to apprehend the thieves.
    In relation to Flt 370 regardless if it would have had GPS tracking built in, it would still be a challenge to locate it, because of shifting currents and depth of the ocean; let alone special equipment to retrieve it from such enormous depth. Any such GPS and related equipment should be inaccessible to the pilots and have only satelite retrievable data ; if bounced to groundstations; then these will be overloaded with data and may therefore only record the last half hour data received as a solution to data overflow.
  • Independent
    Ft.myers, FL
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    Lately it has been a bit more quiet around the missing Flt370 plane; the latest is that also a special torpedo like search tool did not find any wreck etc.
    The most amazing thing is, that no one has found any debris. Knowing aircraft construction and equipment, I'm totally surprised.
    The pinging which they observed must have been also an anomaly.
    Every aircraft has plenty of things in it or on it which can float forever; how about 239 life jackets, all the insulation foam, all closed containers and galley equipment, closed of sealed carbon or stainless steel, alluminum sections; sealed flaps or ailerons (at the Air france plane even the tail floated)
    Then all soda cans, bagage, dead bodies float up after a while etc etc. Since this was a huge plane, it looks like (unless they missed certain sea area's, which I doubt, because satelites can cover a huge whole area) that this plane never hit the water, but must be somewhere on land or in the whatever jungle. ( also since this happened more than a month ago; certain debris should have been observed on beaches or by ships)
    It is virtually impossible to crash in water and have no debriss. What are your opinions?