Right wingers say the US is NOT a Democracy. What do YOU think?

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Forums > All Posts > Right wingers say the US is NOT a Democracy. What do YOU think?

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2011-10-23 02:09 PM

Veronica
Not Selected
Posts: 205

Many right wingers insist that the US is NOT a DEMOCRACY, and that the Founders did not really intend for this nation to become one. What do YOU think? IS THE US a Democracy?

Thomas Paine was one of the founders, & was a good friend with Tom Jefferson & Ben Franklin. He was deeply involved in the American Revolution, & wrote the pamphlets inspiring the people to rise up against the crown of England. You probably heard of "Common Sense" (taught in most schools as being one of his pamphlets). If you want to study our history, what the Founders or the people thought, it can be very wise to read writings by Paine. BUT I WILL MAKE IT VERY EASY, I will put the most important parts right here, (condensed) so even a right wing Republican can understand it. (Can you believe it?) Some of them just don't "get it" even after 235 years. However, to be fair, they probably have been brainwashed to think a lot of totally FALSE propaganda put out on right-wing Radio shows, for many decades. Let's face it, if they believed Obama was "not born in the USA" they'd have to register pretty low on the IQ scale. But that is why Rush Limberger gets paid the BIG BUCKS to spread lies, inuendo, & false propaganda on US air waves every day, for 26 years -- & they even made him "honorary member of the GOP Congress."

We, the People, are being subjected to a PROPAGANDA WAR each & every day, by the enemies of the United States, who want to usurp control over our govt, -- & the WORST part, is that our "enemies" are American citizens, living amongst us, masquerading as a sweet little right-winger, who just happens to vote AGAINST EVERYTHING WE BELIEVE IN, (like MOST of us are ANTI-WAR) & many of us are in favor of Labor Unions, & we want better education standards, & a beautiful prosperous society like we once had before politics went to hell, -- (after the rise of the Birchers (JBS) began in 1958).

The Propaganda War still says (in October 2011) that the US is NOT a Democracy, & was never intended to be one. (I got that statement from a member of this forum TODAY). It is totally illogical, but they still fall for that old line, after 53 yrs of Birch Society brain-washing. Should I prove them wrong?

2011-10-23 03:55 PM

CARLITOS BAM-BAM
Dallas, TX
Posts: 897

Well, we're not a "pure democracy." The Constitution and Representative Democracy makes sure of that.

I have no problem with conceptualizing our nation as a Republic. Ours is supposed to be a constitutional representative democracy. This is certainly a type of "democracy." But not everything is up for debate. Certain things are unconstitutional and illegal. Process for changing constitution is onerous; interesting though, individual states may turn this process into direct-democracy by putting constitutional amendments before the voters.

Still, there are no provisions in the US Constitution for national decision making through direct-democracy, only indirect democracy through Representation. So direct-democracy exists on a national level, but only for representation. And it does bare mention, that state governments put an awful lot of governing decisions directly before voters.

So while our system filters and limits the number of decision makers, it's not supposed to be an Oligarchy where the Representative body is bought and paid for. That is not a government worthy of the name Republic.

So the rightwinger logic can be turned on its head quite easily.

Liberals/progressives/Democrats should not be afraid to describe themselves as good Republicans.

Live free or Occupy. God Save the Republic.

Join a General Assembly in your area....fight back with your "natural rights."

The true Conservatives are the one's fighting for the restoration of the rule of law.

2011-10-23 05:18 PM

Veronica
Not Selected
Posts: 205

Quoting from Thomas Paine's RIGHTS OF MAN (1792) -- "Retaining then, democracy as the ground, --the representative system naturally presents itself." ---- "By ingrafting representation upon democracy, we arrive at a system of govt capable of embracing all the various interests and every extent of territory and population." -- "It is ON THIS SYSTEM THAT THE AMERICAN Government is FOUNDED. IT IS REPRESENTATION ingrafted upon DEMOCRACY."

"What ATHENS was in miniature, AMERICA will be in magnitude." "The one was the wonder of the ancient world, the other is becoming the admiration and model of the present." -- Tom Paine.

Did you KNOW that the World's FIRST Democracy - was in Athens, Greece (in 500 B.C.)? It was a fantastic thing to learn that, since the immense intellectual development going on BEFORE CHRIST was phenomenal, at all levels. They developed geometry, architecture, sculpture, philosophy, debate, and a system of govt that is so sophisticated, we are still in awe of it 25 centuries later. Also note that our greatest govt buildings echo the very Ionic, Corinthian, & Doric columns that were used in Grecian architecture -- back in the mists of early human civilization. Going to Wash DC is almost like walking back in Time, to see the same Obelisk shape (from Egypt) in the Washington Monument. Our US capitol bldgs have a very strong resemblance to the Acropolis in Greece. (Amazing, isn't it?)

While I am in Paine's writings, I will mention here that: "A Constitution is Not the act of a govt, but of a PEOPLE constituting a govt; and government without a Constitution is power without a right."
"All power exercised over a nation must be either delegated or assumed. There are no other sources. All delegated power is TRUST, and all assumed power is USURPATION."

The United States of America consisted of 13 separate states in 1776, each of which established a govt for itself, after the Declaration of Independence. Explanation of how they proceeded, using the example of the state of Pennsylvania: it was divided into 12 counties, each of them had ELECTED a committee, & in due time, Philadelphia proposed a conference of all county committees, to form a government. They all met & discussed the idea of forming a govt, & told each county to ELECT six representatives (for each county) to meet in Philadelphia, with powers to form a Constitution, & propose it for public consideration. (Ben Franklin was President of this convention). They all met & deliberated, & agreed upon a constitution, then ordered it to be "published" for public scrutiny. After it was approved, the convention appointed a day for the general ELECTION of the representatives who were to compose the new government. --- Rights of Man (1792) Thos Paine.

Note: I have capitalized some words to emphasize that the founders did ELECT members of their respective legislative bodies and conferences. Some rightwingers keep telling me that the founders did NOT "elect" any officials at that time. Did not really practice any representative govt. BUT, as usual, the right wingers are WRONG. (They hate the real Truth, but love Rush Limberger) : )

The fact that Thomas Paine was one of the greatest writers in his time, & known world wide, since he also participated in the Revolution in France and in England, -- his words are immortal and an ever lasting memorial to those perilous days, when mankind stood up for their Independence & Freedom.

BUT what can we now expect from the right wing in America? They are AT THIS MOMENT trying to change our US school textbooks to "exclude" the writings of Thomas Paine, so they can re-write history to reflect their own prejudices. To ERASE our Founders and Heroes, to put instead the very idiots that are tearing our country apart, into the forefront of our History books. I can think of no other form of TREASON that is worse than that.

Did you recall "1984" -- novel by George Orwell? Where the main character (in the distant future) had a job "re-writing" history, for Big Brother of their Socialist Utopia, where all people are spied upon all day & night. NO TRUTH is allowed to survive, it all goes "down the memory hole."

WAKE UP AMERICA, the right wing (Tea Baggers & Birchers) have got it all planned for you. It is in full operation at this minute, the "false" Text Books are probably being printed RIGHT NOW. Your kids will be raised on idiot lies and misinformation, leading them to be so confused they will not even know what state they live in, or who their president is. They will be so brain-washed that they will be unable to distinguish Truth or Falsehood, --- Illusion from Reality. Fox News & Rush Limberger have led to 50% of our population being so "ditto head" that they would vote for total airhead idiots. IT IS A TOTAL DISGRACE for our 235 yrs of Democracy to END like THIS. A Revolution led by the stupidest people to ever be allowed near a public podium, leading the masses into insane violence.

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