The politics of Christian Fundamentalism: Norway & the USA

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Forums > All Posts > The politics of Christian Fundamentalism: Norway and the USA

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07-25-2011, 09:32 AM

Schmidt
Colorado Springs, CO
Posts: 1058

When the news broke of the Norway bombing and killing rampage at the Labor Party youth gathering, all the news networks were quick to speculate on an al Qaeda or "Muslim terrorist" connection. Flicking the channels it was the same...from Fox News to CNN to MSNBC...a line of "experts" all surmising the same thing. Even after a "white blond Norwegian" was apprehended, the radical Muslim connection was still alive for many.

Of course we all know now that that speculation was erroneous...that the accused Anders Behring Breivik is a right wing Christian Fundamentalist. Or perhaps many don't know that. It depends on your news sources and what you want to believe. I scanned for news articles this weekend looking for more in-depth articles about Breivek's Christian Fundamentalist views and how they influenced him to act as he did. I didn't find much...and the "experts" had, for the most part, disappeared from the TV screen. Any mention of a Christian Fundamentalist connection was muted...or only mentioned in passing. Maybe it was because of the weekend. I'll be looking forward to see what the cable news networks say about it today.

Will Bill O'Reillly, who championed the "Tiller the baby killer" rhetoric, somehow break from the Rupert Murdoch agenda and condemn the Christian Fundamentalist hate rhetoric that gave rise to these mass murders? Will Rachel Maddow and others on the left have guest appearance by Frank Schaeffer or the like to talk about Christian Fundamentalism in Norway and the USA?

Perhaps one of the most poignant articles this weekend was by Frank Schaeffer, an ex-Evangelical minister, and son of the reknown theologian and Protestant Pastor, Francis Schaeffer. Frank Schaeffer writes an article for Alternet (July 23rd) entitled, Christian Jihad, Why We Should Worry About Right-Wing Terror Attacks Like Norway's in the US where he equates the Christian Fundamentlist movment in the US with the anti-government views...indeed genuine hatred of our government...being espoused by the far right and the Tea Party. Schaeffer words are sharp and critical:

"The terror unleashed on Norway - and the terror now unleashed by the Tea Party through Congress as it holds our economy hostage to extremist "economic" theories that want to destroy our ability to function -- is the sort of white, Christian; far right terror America can expect more of....Call this the ultimate "Tea Party" type "answer" to secularism, modernity, and above all our hated government. Call this the Christian Brotherhood. From far right congress people, to far right gun-toting terror in Norway and here at home, our own Western version of the Taliban is on the rise."

Schaeffer's article is rather long, and you can read it at the above link. I would differ with Schaeffer, however, in the absolute power that he ascribes to the Christian Fundamentalists within the Republican Party. For me, the power base remains with the super rich and corporatists...the plutocrats that still control the money bags. The plutocrats, however, need the Christian Fundamentalists and others identifying with the "Christian political movement" for the power of their voting base. And the Christians need the Republican brand to push their anti-gay, anti-abortion, anti-science agenda. It is a marriage of convenience...or more aptly, an "unholy alliance" based on a shared lust for power.

That shared lust for power worked successfully as long as their respective goals didn't conflict. What we are seeing in the House of Representatives now is opposing views. The plutocrats would like to put this debt ceiling debate to rest for a while as they don't want to jeopardize the cheap money supply of low interest rates to fund their overseas ventures. But the fundamentalists (at least those within the Tea Party) would just as soon wreck havoc with the economy and our government to seek further inroads into building a "Christian state." How will all this play out? I don't know, but I'll share again these words from a noted Republican from the past:

"Goddamn it, John ... the Republicans are selling their soul to win elections ... Mark my word ... if and when these preachers get control of the party, and they’re sure trying to do so, it’s going to be a terrible damn problem." -- Barry Goldwater as told to John Dean

Barry Goldwater's words resonate from his grave today. A final closing quote:

Fundamentalism isn't about religion. It's about power. -- Salman Rushdie

I should point out that while Schaeffer has stereotyped the Christian Fundamentalists, not all of them share the radical views of their more extremist element...and many do not condone the violence against their fellow human beings, whether it be the innocent Norwegians or Doctor Tiller. Nevertheless, it is brand that has been earned, rightly or wrongly, much like the brands that they themselves have applied to all Muslims in the world.

Comments invited.

07-25-2011, 10:09 AM

CARLITOS BAM-BAM
Dallas, TX
Posts: 897

Terrible vibrations. What a foul and dangerous time we live in today?

Goldwater died a repentant man....Like Lee Atwater.

The Boogie Man: The Lee Atwater Story......watch it on netflix.

07-25-2011, 03:32 PM

CARLITOS BAM-BAM
Dallas, TX
Posts: 897

Schmidt, this is just all too terrifying. I just hope that nothing like this ever happens in America. My god, it would be Civil War.

My thoughts are with the victims.
We are all Norwegians.

07-26-2011, 01:37 PM

Schmidt
Colorado Springs, CO
Posts: 1058

Just an update from my original post on Sunday. Media Matters reports (July 25th) that "Before there was any evidence of who was responsible for the terrorist bombing and shooting in Norway, mainstream media outlets rushed to finger Muslims and Muslim groups as potential perpetrators and listed grievances that radical Muslims had against the country."

Media Matters provides a list of TV networks and newspapers all initially fingering "Muslims" for the mass murder.

Also, true to form Fox News pundits are now pushing back on liberals for suggesting that the mass murderer was a Christian. Bill O'Reilly states, "No one believing in Jesus commits mass murder."

Draw whatever conclusions you like...

07-27-2011, 09:31 PM

khadro
Redding, CA
Posts: 5

I'm concerned about the growing power of Christian Fundamentalism in the US. Particularly, the Dominionists, who seek to make the US a Christian theocracy.

12-02-2011, 09:22 PM

Cracam
Not Selected
Posts: 63

Breivik has been declared insane...who writes 1500 pages of dribble? he was no more Fundamentalist Christian than he was a Democrat, maybe many were quick to point the finger at the Muslims because not a day goes by that violence or murder is committed in the name of Allah...

12-02-2011, 09:25 PM

Cracam
Not Selected
Posts: 63

Glad you quoted Salmon Rushdie...he was talking about Islam by the way...and for exercising his freedom of speech he has been in hiding as "the Religion of Peace" has put out a contract on his head...

12-03-2011, 09:15 AM

that guy in Arizona
Flagstaff, AZ
Posts: 158

Salman Rushdie was born into a Muslim family. Iran still believes that the fatwah is in force because only the person who issued it can take it back .. and that guy is dead.

My guess is that there are an awful lot of folks who haven't actually read "The Satanic Verses", but instead listen to what "religioius leaders" are telling them what to think.
I actually tried to read the book myself (not long after I read the Koran) and simply couldn't get through it.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salman_Rushdie

Every religion has its share of crackpots, or fundamentalists. It's absolutely true that there are some Islamic fundamentalists who are dangerous people, but America has the Westboro Baptist Church, Terry Jones, and James Dobson. They ALSO are dangerous people.

It takes a lot of courage to fight fundamentalists, whether they are Isalmic or Christian.

One example of the courageous fighting of Islamic hardliners can be found in the book "Infidel" , by Ayaan Hirsi Ali. She was born in Somalia, but escaped to Holland (where she got elected to Parliament) to avoid an "arranged marriage. She acted in a movie called "Submission", which you can view at the link below:

www.youtube.com/watch?v=G6bFR4_Ppk8

The producer of the movie, Theo Van Gogh, was assassinated by an Islamic fundamentalist.

In November of last year, I attended an inter-faith Thanksgiving service in Evanston.
The featured speaker was an Islamic religious leader. My comments about the event are attached below:

tohell-andback.blogspot.com/2010/11/thanksgiving-with-enemy.html

I agree with Schmidt that we should all make an effort to learn about the religion of other people. Not long after to moving to Evanston, I decided to visit ALL of the churches in town (there are over 100), and got through about 65 or so before I ran out of energy. If you listen to Paul Harvey's clip below, I think you'll agree that it really DOESN'T MATTER what religion somebody follows, as long as they make an effort to treat others respectfully, even those who disagree with them:

www.youtube.com/watch?v=aYEFkYtANVg

12-03-2011, 08:38 PM

Cracam
Not Selected
Posts: 63

Arizona i couldn't agree more with your last sentence...but try doing that, building or starting a church in any Muslim country and see what happens? They want tolerance and acceptance here in North America but it ends when you enter their borders..

12-04-2011, 10:46 AM

that guy in Arizona
Flagstaff, AZ
Posts: 158

Cracam:

Your point is valid.

Since Islam, Christianity, and Judaism have the same "root" (Abraham) you'd think that it would be logical for all of them to get along better. After all, they are all officially called "abrahamic" religions.

The most fascinating example of how they DO share space that is considered sacred to all of them is the Dome of the Rock, whihch you can read about in the link below:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dome_of_the_Rock

My wife and I have friends who belong to the Baha'i relgion, which was started in present day Iran. Even though the followers of the Baha'i faith are the most peaceful people that you have ever met, the Iranian government has been persecuting them almost continuosly, and does so even today, in spite of the "freedom of religion" phrase that is a part of the modern Iranian constitution. The official Baha'i website (below) has an article about
the attempted eradication of the faith in Iran:

www.bahai.org/

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