Forum Thread

14th Amendment being attacked

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  • Democrat
    Beverly, MA
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    The 14th amendment is being attacked. "A coalition of Republican state legislators are doing just that by attempting to change the citizenship clause of the 14th Amendment -- or at least how it is interpreted -- to deny citizenship to the U.S. children of illegal immigrants."

    The way the 14th Amendment reads currently:
    "All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside."

    If you are born here you are a citizen...it doesn't matter if your parents are illegal. That's the way it has been and the way it should always be.
    What do you think? Does it encourage illegal immigrants to flock here and possibly die trying or is it a good amendment. Do you want to change it?
  • Democrat
    Beverly, MA
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    I say don't change the 14th amendment:

    In this country, we don't visit the sins of the parent onto the child. And it's unseemly for the GOP to be seen as attacking children whose only "sin" is having the temerity to be born on U.S. soil.
  • Democrat
    Beverly, MA
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    2. What part of "legal" and "U.S. citizen" don't these activists understand? They can't back date the amendment and honestly who would want to change it? Thank goodness it's really hard to change an amendment.
  • Democrat
    Beverly, MA
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    How do you interpret the consitiution? Many people say it should be a strict interpretation, meaning that there is no deviation. For those of you that believe strict...guess what you are stuck.
  • Democrat
    Beverly, MA
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    Some people say the states have a right to pass this. Go back to 5th grade. A state doesn't have the right to pass a law that denies residents a right protected by the U.S. Constitution.
  • Democrat
    Beverly, MA
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    Another argument is that Mothers and Fathers are not being deported because they had a baby here. These are called anchor babies. Guess what there are no longer anchor babies, parents are being deported even if they had a child here who is a US citizen.
  • Democrat
    Beverly, MA
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    "The Republican Party is planting the seeds of its own demise with this stunt. Polls show that the majority of Latinos are not in support of an open border, and they'll go along with border enforcement. But they are opposed to what they consider the radical and mean-spirited idea of stripping citizenship away from children. With an estimated 60 million Latinos in the country, the GOP should pick a different fight." article
  • Democrat
    Jeffersonville, IN
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    You are 100% correct on this at least in my estimation. The right tries and tries to make its paranoid "agenda" palatable to the general public. But its things like this that show just how mean spirited they really are. I 'm afraid that I dont share your optimism about the legality of the states doing this though. You know AND I know what the constitution says..... but some of these nut jobs will undoubtedly try to pass laws that will skirt the issue if not outright flaunt it. After the Supreme Court decision about corporate "donations" for political candidates I find that I have absolutely no confidence that any "popular" law will be voted down. Can you imagine faux news after a law like that was declared unconstitutional?
  • Strongly Liberal Democrat
    Democrat
    Portland, OR
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    I wouldn't worry too much just yet, LLBarry. States can try in vain to pass whatever laws they would like, but the Constitution trumps them all. If the Supreme Court decides that babies born inside of the United States to "illegal" parents are not citizens, they would be rolling back over 200 years of precedent to the contrary. As upset as I was about Citizens United, I am rather confident that the Supreme Court wouldn't dare touch this issue.

    Another reason I am so confident is that the demographics in our country are changing at a rapid pace. If the Republican Party doesn't make a change quickly, they will lose the fastest growing demographic in our country. I can't imagine that they would seriously push this change to the 14th Amendment at a National level. Sure, some of the Southern states will try to pass some State Laws, but they would almost certainly be overturned by the federal courts.

    The last time the Supreme Court took up the citizenship question was in United States v. Wong Kim Ark, decided back in 1898. This case set the legal precedent that nearly anyone born on US soil, regardless of their parents citizenship, is a United States citizen. Because of this and the use of stare decisis the states can try all they want, but try is all they would be doing.
  • Democrat
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    Clarification please! Is there not a law (?) in existence that provides: any baby born on a US flag ship automatically has that country's citizenship? Just asking.,.,.,..
  • Liberal Democrat
    Democrat
    Colorado Springs, CO
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    Dodie Wrote: Clarification please! Is there not a law (?) in existence that provides: any baby born on a US flag ship automatically has that country's citizenship? Just asking.,.,.,..
    Dodie --

    I think this link to LegalZoom answers your question:

    Is Your Child a U.S. Citizen if Born Abroad?

    "What you might not know is the borders for citizenship. Those born within U.S. ports and harbors or within 12 nautical miles of U.S. borders are also American citizens. Even babies born on planes flying over the U.S. or its territories acquire U.S. citizenship. The ship or plane's country of origin makes no difference regarding citizenship."

    The key is "within the US borders, including airspace."
  • Strongly Liberal Democrat
    Democrat
    Portland, OR
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    I thought about starting a new thread on this, but the title of this thread that was written nearly five years ago is as valid now as it was five years ago.

    I sometimes wonder if Republicans actually know how to read or understand basic words of the English language. Here's the full text of the first section of the 14th Amendment. (Bold section highlighted by me)

    Section 1.

    All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside. No state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

    There is absolutely no ambiguity here. It doesn't say "this only applies to former slaves" or "this only applies to who we decide to make it apply to;" it states that ALL people born or naturalized in the United States are citizens of the United States.

    What's sad is that plenty of Republicans in this country genuinely believe that we should repeal birthright citizenship. My question to them then is who gets to decide who gets to be an American citizen or not? What if a white person who supported the Amendment has a baby that is denied American citizenship because the people deciding didn't want to grant it to them? Will they still support it then?

    Here's the thing Republicans won't admit when they spew out all this nonsense about repealing birthright citizenship--they are terrified that the demographics in this country are changing and they are desperate to cling on to their majority. And since they aren't willing to moderate their xenophobic views they are proposing to change the way we determine who gets to become an American citizen. The problem with them doing this is that they may get a few angry old white people to lap up their nonsensical bullshit, but they are just digging a deeper and deeper hole with non-white voters who will be the majority in this country in the not too distant future.

  • Democrat
    Missouri
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    Glad this has been brought up. Anybody searched on how many politicians, community leaders, judges, police, fireman, herald business leaders, CEO's, doctors, nurses, and all that make America succeed are gong to be removed from this country because they came from noncitizen parents. If all these people are first generation citizens because they were born on U.S. soil from parents that may have illegally entered the country than Trump says, "He has to deport them.".

    Three politicians I can think of immediately are Cruz, Jindal, and Rubio. Does Trump have a fight he has already lost before he even tries? Cruz for sure had parents that did not enter the country legally, especially his father who was denied being a presidential candidate because of his illegal status.

  • Are you sure you want to delete this post?
        
    Well if the Gophers, and Tea Maggots want to repeal the 14th amendment , then the Liberals can work on repealing the 2nd amendment, maybe then a lot less people would be getting shot and killed..
  • Independent
    Ft.myers, FL
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    All these threads show that documents which were decided more than a hundred years ago often can not be adapted to modern times. These amendments need to be amended again to reflect our present situation and evolvement.

    For instance because of the wrongly written 14th Amendment; babies who were born here and moved elsewhere when still an infant are now penalized by living abroad, they pay the taxes and work there and have families there as well never returned to the US, now because of the new introduced FATCA law demanding that they are subject to US taxes, while they never worked or lived here or had social security from here. This is pure ridiculous. Just an birth certificate does not show where you live and work all your life. Most of these people have dual citizenship anyway. Thus most of these old documents are totally misused the same as the second Amendment; guns of today do not resemble/reflect guns of more than a hundred years ago.