"Liberals" are the real "Conservatives".....flashback: Rep. Louise Slaughter vs. HR 6166..

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Forums > All Posts > "Liberals" are the real "Conservatives".....flashback: Rep. Louise Slaughter vs. HR 6166..

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2010-12-31 04:13 PM

CARLITOS BAM-BAM
Dallas, TX
Posts: 897

watch: Sept 27, 2006 Louise Slaughter vs. HR. 6166.(the Military Commissions Act)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dYUXsrrqFKg

Whose resisting more fundamental change?
Whose fighting against Big Brother?
Who shows more concern for the Constitution?

THE "LIBERAL" DEMOCRATS!!!!!!!!

MAMA SLAUGHTER ROCKS!!!!!

2011-01-02 05:22 PM

CARLITOS BAM-BAM
Dallas, TX
Posts: 897

Here's Rep. Nancy Pelosi vs. the Military Commissions Act....Sept 27, 2006

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GiOGlqLdjiM&feature=channel

Pelosi and Slaughter .....resisting fundamental, unlawful, unethical, and unconstitutional change to fundamental American values....

2011-02-19 06:11 PM

libforlife
Boerne, TX
Posts: 2

CARLITOS BAM-BAM Wrote: Here's Rep. Nancy Pelosi vs. the Military Commissions Act....Sept 27, 2006

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GiOGlqLdjiM&feature=channel

Pelosi and Slaughter .....resisting fundamental, unlawful, unethical, and unconstitutional change to fundamental American values....

What &%!$#Ing kind of liberal are you? Obama STANDS for change, and if you are a true Democrat, you ought to be supporting the changes he wants. What do you mean that Democrats are the true Conservatives who resist the changes he's trying to make??? The "fundmental American values are RIGHT WING based values! Have they gotten to you??? Yeah, man, they have, haven't they? Be honest now. And what do you think is unconstitutional about what our president wants to do to change America? You sound like you are a secret right winger hiding out in this forum. Convince me you're not.

2011-02-20 07:44 AM

CARLITOS BAM-BAM
Dallas, TX
Posts: 897

Well I have never have been accused of being a rightwinger...so this is a first.
I can assure you, if you dig a litte further on this website you will find that I'm a Liberal Democrat of the highest order.
Try starting with "Bad Gonzo Craziness on the Darkside of the Spectrum" and why not check out my commentary on "We are all Socialists Now"

Now in regards to Liberals being the True Conservatives, well this goes along with my Beyond the Looking Glass thesis on American politics.

In my view Liberal, Conservative, Libertarian, or Socialist, etc. etc. these are not descriptive nouns....they are Proper nouns, like Jill, Bob, Steve, and Nicky....they have lost all descriptive meaning....and have shifted many times over.....

Modern conservatism is supposed to be an offshoot of classic liberalism.....For generations, Edmund Burke has served as the inspirational founder to the conservative movement. Burke offered dissent within the liberal tradition that was transforming his world....he embraced the need for change, but stood also to protect the crown from mob overthrow....
Classical conservatism and modern conservatism are not supposed to be the same thing....Classical conservatism is the original big government ideology. In theory, modern conservatives are supposed to be the true classic liberals.....whereas we modern liberals have departed from classic liberalism and have supposedly embraced it's antithesis, which is b.s. in my opinion.

Now considering the level and intensity of change that modern conservatives seek, one could hardly call it conservatism.....Burke sought to guard against unintended consequences. He was mindful of the need to embrace change for the sake of preserving order, but he also was careful to not sacrifice stability by running unnecessary risks for the sake of marginal gains. Less than perfect was preferable to the inevitable chaos resulting from an immediate radical realignment of everything.

The Tea Party crowd is seeking to turn back the clock on the established order.....they are seeking to radically redefine the status quo.....
Compared to Obama, the President is the Real Conservative....now that is not to say that Obama is not a change agent, he is...but the kinds of changes that Obama has sought are fundamentally less radical than what is called for by the Radical Right. In the post ww2 era, mainstream conservatives have supported a social saftey net....neoconservatives moved the paleos to multicultural tolerance..
but now they seek to radically redefine the status quo....they are looking to recapture lost ground.....they are Revanchists.

Now as far as the Big government vs Small government arguments that have come to define the political debate between so called "liberals" and "conservatives"......Call me crazy, but if the standard is that liberals are for big state-government and conservatives are for small state-government....WE LIBERALS ARE THE ACTUAL CONSERVATIVES!!! Trust me, there is no bigger government entity than the U.S. military......Social Security might spend more...but it's the people's money and unlike the warfare state, it's been paid for till 2037, and Social Security has nowhere near the number of personnel that the DoD has at its disposal. The National Security State is what we should fear more than anything else, and so called "conservatives" are in love with it! Government spending on the social saftey net is not tyranny in action.....it's unionism.....we are but one people all reaching out for what is possible...and we "liberals" dare say, United We Stand or Divided We Fall...and there is no greater division in this country than wealth inequality....and we believe in logical and constitutional steps to improve upon the financial and human condition of the American family and worker as they face a world-stacked against them.

Now, "liberals" are in large part furious with Obama over his so called "Bush-like" manuevarings in national security affairs....In his defense, I would like to remind them that everytime this President has tried to do the right the thing on Guantanamo, or for civilian trials, he's been blocked by Congressional revolts spanning from moderate-centrist-blue dog democrats to reptialian conservative pricks....And from these constraints the President has crafted compromise...which has infuriated his liberal base.

My argument is this...American liberalism has come to stand for both modern social liberalism and the Anglo-American conservative tradition......In a strange sense, modern liberals are both "liberals" and "conservatives"...we have to be both....we have to do all the work ourselves....we have to check ourselves....because what's offered as "conservative" dissent within the liberal tradition in this country is on fucking Mars....we have no equals on the otherside.....they have been slaughtered by the rancid erosion of the American Character and laid to waste like dogs. Tea Party politics is an apostate movement, a complete fraud, a massive orgy of angry Know-Nothings tripping out from their brainwashing. They don't give a goddamn about Edmund Burke....and if they don't, well I will.

2011-07-26 05:27 AM

pray
St Pete, FL
Posts: 5

Wow, now that is interesting, compare Obama to say G Soros then he becomes a conservative. Wow, intellectual dishonesty at a level I never thought I would see. Thanks for the morning chuckled, with these bobbleheads running the institution it is always good to have a small smile on my face before they dispense the morning meds.
keep it up and maybe you can replace Glenn Beck on TV!

2011-07-26 09:30 AM

CARLITOS BAM-BAM
Dallas, TX
Posts: 897

Um....I'm not comparing Obama to Soros.
I'm comparing Obama to the tea party GOP, and calling the president the (descriptive noun) conservative of the two.
If you compare the level of change expressly sought by the president to that sought by the tea parties.....one should not be confused by who is the moderate.
In the final analysis, the Anglo-American conservative tradition boils down to moderate communitarianism....where traditions are respected and change is subject to dispassionate debate & reason. It's dissent within the liberal theory of government.

Ultimately, Burke's English heirs proved themselves amenable to progressive change, and it's one of the reasons that the English throne still exists, albeit in neutered form. And also one of the reasons why the Conservative party in England is responsible for NHS.

American Conservatism has proven to be a revanchist, reactionary revolution.....and so called Conservatives here have more in common with the French then they will ever know.

2011-08-03 02:34 PM

mtduffer
Clancy, MT
Posts: 3

Why can't people remember and understand what JFK stood for: Low Taxes; Responsible Education and Health Programs; Strong economical fiscal responsibilities, top of world Space Program and a very strong defense, including the best trained and equipped military.

Now, step back and see what BOTH parties have done. Our Taxes are at the breaking point; Our Education has slipped below the top ten in the world and Physical Education is non-existent; Our Nation is "out of control" in the bookkeeping department and we are about to lose our AAA rating. Not to mention that our Elected Officials, including, President Obama using that to scare the citizens of this great nation. We have scraped our Space Program and we are about to dismantle our military and our defense weaponry.

We must start reorganizing our Fiscal where-with-all and get back on track.

We must start upgrading our schools and actually teach something instead of trying to indoctrinate our students in one direction. At this time they are being taught a Left Wing ideology.

We must start getting back to basic Physical Education -- maybe, just maybe, the Obesity problem we have in our school system would go down.

We should stop "Paying Peter to Pay Paul" syndrome. How about, for the first time in our history, that our government agencies start living with-in their budgets instead of overspending witch tells the government that they need more money the next year.

We should restart our Space Program and continue to have the best in the world.

Our military should never be reduced ---- it should be expanded and newer armament and weaponry be upgraded.

2011-09-08 09:11 AM

kartman
Methuen, MA
Posts: 1

Mr. lib for life I have to say I like Obama but sometimes his policies seem much more in tune with the gop than with his base the democrats

2011-09-08 10:12 AM

Schmidt
Colorado Springs, CO
Posts: 1058

Conservatives often quote John F. Kennedy when they make a pitch for lowering taxes even further.

"It is a paradoxical truth that tax rates are too high and tax revenues are too low and the soundest way to raise the revenues in the long run is to cut the rates now ... Cutting taxes now is not to incur a budget deficit, but to achieve the more prosperous, expanding economy which can bring a budget surplus." – John F. Kennedy, Nov. 20, 1962, president's news conference

However, what they fail to mention is that the top marginal tax rate for couples filing joint returns in 1962 was 91 percent for joint income over $400,000. So yes it made sense then for JFK to push for lower taxes.

Today the top marginal tax rate is 35 percent for joint incomes over $379,150.

Furthermore, according to the Center on Budget and Policy Priorites:

Middle-income Americans are now paying federal taxes at or near historically low levels, according to the latest available data. That’s true whether it comes to their federal income taxes or their total federal taxes.

Income taxes: A family of four in the exact middle of the income spectrum will pay only 4.7 percent of its income in federal income taxes this year, according to a new analysis by the Urban Institute-Brookings Institution Tax Policy Center. This is the third-lowest percentage in the past 50 years, after 2008 and 2009.

Overall federal taxes: Middle-income households are paying overall federal taxes — which include income as well as payroll and excise taxes — at or near their lowest levels in decades, according to the latest data from the Congressional Budget Office (CBO).

Cutting taxes again and again is politically popular to get elected, but will ultimately result in larger and larger deficits. And that's exactly what we have today...not only the lowest taxes in 50 years, but also an infrastructure that is failing because we don't have the tax revenue to fix it, a curtailed space program because we can't afford it, and other social programs including education under attack. At the same time our military expenditures are consuming a disproportunate share of our remaining tax revenue...53 cents of every income tax dollar if you factor in Veterans care and the cost of borrowing for the existing wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Just putting things into perspective when people make the pitch to lower taxes even further or increase military spending.

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