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Forums > All Posts > "Say no to Socialism"
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2010-03-24 03:02 PM
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Zach F
Denton, TX
Posts: 941

"This morning I was awoken by my alarm clock powered by electricity generated be the public monopoly regulated by the U.S. Department of Energy.  I then took a shower in the clean water provided by the municipal water utility. After that, I turned on the TV to one of the FCC regulated channels to see what the National Weather Service of the National Oceanographic and Atmospheric Agency determined the weather was go to be like using satellites designed, built and launched by the National Aeronautics and Space Agency. I watched this while eating my breakfast of U.S. Department of Agriculture inspected food and taking the drugs which have be determined safe by the Food and Drug Administration.

 

At the appropriate time, as regulated by the U.S. congress and kept accurate by the National Institute of Standards and Technology and the U.S. Naval Observatory, I get into my National Highway Traffic Safety Administration approved automobile and set out to work on the roads built by the local, state, and federal Departments of Transportation, possibly stopping to purchase additional fuel of a quality determined by the Environmental Protection Agency, using legal tender issued by the Federal Reserve Bank. On the way out the door, I deposit any mail I have to be sent out via the U.S. Postal Service and drop my kids off at public school.

 

After work, I drive my NHTSA car back home on the DOT roads, to a house which has not burned down in my absence because of the state and local building codes and fire marshal’s inspection, and which has not been plundered of all its valuables thanks to the local police department.

 

I then log on to the internet which was developed by the Defense Advanced Research Projects Administration and post on freerepublic.com and Fox news forums about how SOCIALISM in medicine is BAD because the government can’t do anything right."

~Anonymous

2010-03-25 08:04 AM

Schmidt
Colorado Springs, CO
Posts: 1058

When Ronald Reagan said in his 1981 inaugural address, "government is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem," he set in motion a movement that some 29 years later has split America.  The anti-government paranoia of today, manifesting itself in the Tea Partiers, right wing militias and the right wing radicals within the Republican Party, thrives on fear, hate, ignorance and false talking points repeated over and over again by right wing politicians and right wing media figures, largely funded by corporate money that profits from and exploits anger and rage. 

One cannot even have an intellectual discussion or debate on the issues of the day because we cannot even agree on the facts, as "revisionist history making" also manifests itself in their delusional, selfish thinking.  Fear and hate block out all rational thought, and as long as the Rush Limbaughs and Glenn Becks of this world continue to make tons of money selling fear and hate to the ignorant at the expense of our country and government, then we will continue down that slippery slope. Selling hate and rage is like selling pornography...it is very profitable.  I call them the "hate profiteers."  But they do not represent or speak for real Americans.
2010-03-25 07:42 PM

Lori
Amarillo, TX
Posts: 9
Wow - I guess I never really looked at it that way.  Very good food for thought.
2010-03-26 10:50 AM

dallyfan
Dallas, TX
Posts: 17
"This morning I was awoken by my alarm clack powered by electricity..."

And you weren't forced to do any of those things. Isn't liberty great.
2010-03-26 01:56 PM
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Zach F
Denton, TX
Posts: 941

If you are arguing that the clause that makes health insurance mandatory for all Americans takes away one's liberties, you are making quite a stretch.

While I do not agree with the mandatory requirement of this current bill, I do feel that the government should offer health insurance alongside the private sector. Health care should be considered a public good, like roads, education, and the many other examples in the above argument.  This will increase the standard of living and be beneficial for America as a whole. As I understand it, the new law only requires that you have health insurance, whether you get it from the government or the private sector is not a factor.  Your choices and liberties are still there, now there is just one more option.

 

P.S. Typo fixed.

2010-03-26 02:26 PM

dallyfan
Dallas, TX
Posts: 17
there's no stretch. the public option will become the dominating plan with the next 10 yrs simply from a cost stand point and the govt knows it. history shows it. forcing you to buy health insurance is a violent attack on americans liberties. govt ran health plans in every country are the dominant plan and this country will be no different. you will be pulled into it slowly and the govt hopes you don't notice.
2010-03-26 02:42 PM
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Zach F
Denton, TX
Posts: 941

Its hardly a "violent attack." When people go into the emergency room, the hospital is required to treat them. The cost of that treatment is passed out amongst all those with insurance. This is one of the many reasons that health care is extremely costly in this country.  While I do not agree with the idea of making health insurance mandatory, I do understand the reasoning behind it. If it doesn't work, then there can be some amending done to the law. The status quo was not working well, and something needed to be done.

This is a work in progress and more changes can, and probably will, be made, but doing nothing just wasn't really a viable option anymore.

2010-03-26 02:55 PM

dallyfan
Dallas, TX
Posts: 17
yes change is tough to handle and "sometimes" is still the right thing to do. but doing nothing is better than changing to something that can make things worse.

i appreciate your example of our current system of an uninsured person going to the emergency room to get free treatment, and the cost is passed on. no doubt about that. but when you hear the bogus numbers the libs throw out about 40 mill uninsured who just can't receive health care....your example is perfect. the libs conveniently leave out the part of the story that these people do receive health care and in our current system it's free to them because you and i pay for it. it is simply dishonest rhetoric to say 40 mill people are not receiving health care. the marcelas owens story was a pathetic case of the blatant dishonesty. lib politicians intentially twisting the truth of what really happened with his moms health care.
2010-03-26 07:33 PM

Listening
Lenexa, KS
Posts: 49
I guess I would ask if you think you are getting the best value for your dollar from all of these institutions ?

Or, is that even a concern of yours ? (and that is not meant to be a loaded question).

I have worked in power generation myself on the private side and am somewhat familiar with the practices of some regulated utilities. They are not always the best in terms of using dollars or providing a good quality product (i.e. the cleanest air).

I struggle with the term "can't do anything right". Obviously, as you described they are competent enough to get the job done. I often think that conservatives don't really do a good job of expressing their message which is:

There are better ways to do it (if you believe in outsourcing and privatising all you can.....I certainly think the Post Office is a candiate for such an effort...and this is not an argument for everything being done that way).

Good intentions often turn into overbloated institutions that develop lives of their own. The EPA and OSHA are prime examples to me.

I would be more than happy to discuss current gasoline quality and specifications with you sometime and how gasoline is probably more expensive than it needs to be (notice I said "probably") thanks to the EPA going way beyond anything that makes sense to the refining industry.

Let's not even talk about how we are killing refining in the U.S., but are more than willing to bring gasoline onshore that is produced in facilities that do things like dump sulfuric acid directly into rivers.
2010-03-26 07:35 PM

Listening
Lenexa, KS
Posts: 49
dallyfan Wrote: "This morning I was awoken by my alarm clack powered by electricity..."

And you weren't forced to do any of those things. Isn't liberty great.





What is liberty ?
2010-03-26 07:38 PM

Listening
Lenexa, KS
Posts: 49
Zach F Wrote:

If you are arguing that the clause that makes health insurance mandatory for all Americans takes away one's liberties, you are making quite a stretch.

While I do not agree with the mandatory requirement of this current bill, I do feel that the government should offer health insurance alongside the private sector. Health care should be considered a public good, like roads, education, and the many other examples in the above argument. This will increase the standard of living and be beneficial for America as a whole. As I understand it, the new law only requires that you have health insurance, whether you get it from the government or the private sector is not a factor. Your choices and liberties are still there, now there is just one more option.

P.S. Typo fixed.






I have yet to see an economic model that supports or refutes the argument about health insurance increasing the standard of living.

Do you have one ?

And the CBO is not an answer.
2010-03-27 08:36 PM
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Zach F
Denton, TX
Posts: 941
It's not health insurance that would increase the standard of living, but health care.  Healthy people live a higher quality of life. I'm not sure what exactly you are requesting when you ask for an economic model to show that, it sounds like common sense to me.
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